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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall (Read 36314 times)
Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #60 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 6:22pm
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I hope my grandfather got this rifle for a good price because its discrepancies are driving me nuts. It's definitely a low wall but it is chambered for 45-70 and under the barrel is a 2 about an inch in front of the fore stock. So this doesn't make sense. Would they have turned the shank down and rethreaded it to fit a low wall?
  
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BP
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #61 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 6:34pm
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Nathan,

Just curious...
Have you removed the forearm from the rifle to examine the underside of the barrel for a calibre stamping?
  

There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves.
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chawk
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #62 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 6:42pm
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That two is the barrel weight.  Low walls got ones and twos. That means that it is a small shank receiver, just as we thought.  The chamber doesn't mean anything.  Someone could have rechambered or rebored it in the past. 

I'm not sure I understand what discrepancies you are talking about...it seems like a fairly standard early low wall to me.
  
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frnkeore
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #63 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 6:54pm
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At this point, I think Nathan needs to purchase John Campbell's book, The Winchester Single Shot.

Many details in it and will answer many, many of your questions. All HW/LW owners should have it.

Frank
  

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Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #64 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:00pm
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On the underside there is a large leaf spring. Under it is WCF. Between the spring and the mounting bolt for the stock is the number 2. It looks like someone tried to file that same area to remove any markings but I can still read the 2. On top of the barrel is WCF and a number 2, located about 1/4 inch before the W.
  
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BP
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #65 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:21pm
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OK, Nathan.
You have a WCF marking on both the top, and on the underside of the barrel.
The 45-70 cartridge was a cartridge developed by the US Military, it was not a cartridge developed by Winchester Repeating Arms.
Winchester factory marked the WRA rifles factory chambered for the 45-70 as 45-70 , not as 45-70 WCF.
The presence of the "WCF" in both locations on the barrel indicates that your rifle never left the WRA factory as a 45-70, but did leave the factory as a rifle produced in one of the "WCF" suffixed chamberings that were then available in the particular time period for the Low-wall you have in hand.
  

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Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #66 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:38pm
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In that case my barrel must be an original 32 WCF that was rebored to a larger size. That would explain why they tried to file off the original caliber indication. Now things are making more sense. You've helped me solve the mystery of this barrel. I always thought that someone had switched barrels, but not so.
  
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Redsetter
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #67 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:45pm
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BP wrote on Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:21pm:

Winchester factory marked the WRA rifles factory chambered for the 45-70 as 45-70 , not as 45-70 WCF.


Yes, but they weren't so conscientious when they appropriated Stevens' .25-20 SS, calling it .25 WCF, until their own brainstorm, the .25-20 repeater was developed, after which the .25 WCF designation was transferred to it.
  
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Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #68 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 7:54pm
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Some looked up the serial number for me last week and noted that the rifle was originally built as a 32 WCF. However, I assumed incorrectly that they had replaced the barrel. 

It looks like my only option is to re-line it or find another barrel in one of the original calibers. I expect that it will be much cheaper to buy a used barrel to fit it.
  
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Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #69 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 8:12pm
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Will a model 94 44-40 barrel fit my low wall?

Green mountain WL3628 is a 44-40 27" tapered octagon for $180. It has a 1:36 twist. What can anyone tell me about it. Does it still have to be threaded?
They have another one that is 29" for an 1886 and similar. Will that fit my low wall?
« Last Edit: Sep 13th, 2016 at 8:22pm by Nathan Davis »  
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chawk
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #70 - Sep 13th, 2016 at 8:21pm
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It looks like your extractor has been modified too. If that is the case it will need to be changed back.  It is possible that you could buy a used extractor and a used barrel and have everything work in your rifle...but it is unlikely.
  
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #71 - Sep 14th, 2016 at 12:02am
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Nathan Davis wrote on Sep 13th, 2016 at 8:12pm:
Will a model 94 44-40 barrel fit my low wall?

Green mountain WL3628 is a 44-40 27" tapered octagon for $180. It has a 1:36 twist. What can anyone tell me about it. Does it still have to be threaded?
They have another one that is 29" for an 1886 and similar. Will that fit my low wall?

Nathan,
The lowwall and highwall barrels were both threaded at 16 TPI, and used either a large or small barrel shank diameter.
If you have concluded that your lowwall uses the small barrel shank diameter, then:
The 92 and 94 barrels are threaded at 20 TPI, and have a  slightly smaller barrel shank diameter than the small shank diameter used for your lowwall.
The 1886 barrel is also threaded at 20 TPI, and has a barrel shank diameter that is larger than your lowwall small shank diameter, but is smaller than a highwall large shank diameter.
Also, the centerfire highwall and low wall barrels have an extractor cut at 9 o'clock, while the 1892 and 1894 and 1886 barrels have their extractor cuts at 12 o'clock, plus the 1886 has two additional barrel cuts at 6 o'clock for the bottom of the breechbolt at the ejector.
You need to call green mountain and talk to them about a barrel that will specifically fit your lowwall.
  

There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves.
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #72 - Sep 14th, 2016 at 8:17am
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Nathan Davis wrote on Sep 13th, 2016 at 8:12pm:
Will a model 94 44-40 barrel fit my low wall?

Green mountain WL3628 is a 44-40 27" tapered octagon for $180. It has a 1:36 twist. What can anyone tell me about it. Does it still have to be threaded?
They have another one that is 29" for an 1886 and similar. Will that fit my low wall?


Nathan, 

     If you are referring to the Grn Mtn barrel blank that they used to refer to as their "small lever action" barrel or some such, the one that came profiled but unthreaded and unchambered, the answer is yes.  I got one in a 25 cal for one of my low-walls and had it threaded and chambered to 25-20 SS quite readily.  It came from Grn Mtn with a round section at the breech end, so I got it fitted with a "tulip" end where it meets the receiver.  No one would mistake it for original... it looks more like a #2 or #4 Ballard, but it makes for a pretty little rifle.

Froggie
  
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #73 - Sep 14th, 2016 at 11:19am
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If it were a multi generation pass down rifle, I would line it. If it were me, when I handed it to my grandson, I'd want it to appear the same way it looked when my grandpa looked it over, except for the stories that the patina had to tell. I'd also suspect that it's an expedient convert to .410, and maybe not grandpa's go to deer rifle. I wouldn't suspect a 'dental drill' could hone the entire barrel length smooth. I'd ask your uncle if gramps had any other guns, then you might figure out more of what he liked or needed to hunt. This one may seem to fit in as a squirrel or pest gun, and possible some type of trade in a simpler time.

If(?) it was originally a 32-20, I'd have it lined that way, likely within budget if a new barrel and smithing is under consideration. Otherwise, I'd go 22lr. Either way, I'd take my grandson tin can plinking as much as possible instead of telling him to put it away and save it for hunting season. If it turns out to be a safe .410, then maybe have it discreetly stamped and leave it alone. Only thoughts is all, hope it all works out.

  
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Nathan Davis
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Re: Need advice to re-barrel an 1885 low wall
Reply #74 - Sep 14th, 2016 at 12:50pm
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My mother and uncle remember my grandfather bringing in quite a few deer with it and my uncle says it was chambered as a rifle, not as a shotgun. I can still see some rifling so I think my uncle fairly well destroyed the barrel with his dentist drill -- a rotary sanding drum on a long thin flexible line. Regardless, the present caliber of 45-70 is way out of line for the LW. I'm seeing a smith this afternoon to get estimates for re-lining. I gave my grandson a 22 last Christmas so he no longer need one.
  
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