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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Traditional Rifle rules revisited (Read 38247 times)
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #75 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 7:35am
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Steve's point on pre 1917 makes a lot of sense, easy to understand and administer. Only change from current  rules would be remove the newer external scopes exemption.   

Rule of thumb, scopes resolve to their power, example B5 MVA would resolve to 1/5 Moa.  20x STS would resolve to 1/20 Moa. Difference  in 1/5 and 1/20 is not a factor in offhand matches. Limited to pre 1917 would be acceptable restriction.

I shoot a lot of offhand most with Iron sight Single shots and Lever actions, last few years have used the MVA B5 on my Schetzen with no measurable loss in score.

Also shoot fair amount with modern Silhouette rifles and 20x Scopes.  Only reason for 20 modern Silhouette is small targets need high scope power to pick your spot on poorly defined targets with difficult background. If the target is well defined with a clear aiming point like our 25 ring target no need for a high power scope to shoot well offhand. 

Would also like to see any Traditional designation limited to Offhand matches.  No sense handicapping bench guns, overwhelming majority of bench shooting is with modern single shots. Traditional limited bench would mean very few competitors. 

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40_Rod
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #76 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 8:43am
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Perhaps the most famous bench match was the Walnut Hill gun club Breech loaded rifles Against the National Rifle Club Muzzle loaded rifles. The participants included Norman Brockway, Milton Farrow, and a young Harry Pope. Muzzle loaders beat the Walnut hill crowd so badly that when AC Gould who had planned a big article on superiority of the breech-loading rifle, only devoted a few lines to the match saying "good scores were made by all". 
Rules in those days only allowed for muzzle rest the only, the butt was held or balanced on the fist as modern Slug-gun shooters do. 
Anyone wanting to learn more about early Bench shooting should get The muzzle Loading Cap lock rifle by Ned Roberts. It is truly his best work. Also The Warner-Lowe letters on disc from the ASSRA archives. Horace Warner and William Lowe were two prominent gunsmiths that made both muzzle-loading and breech-loading bench rifles. The letters can get way up in the weeds but there are some fascinating insights there.
40 Rod
  
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Steve Garbe
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #77 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 10:35am
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Gentlemen,

Many good points brought forward.

In my limited experience, the use of a date for technology cutoff has two major advantages. One, it provides for a very simple set of rules and two, it harnesses the inclination of shooters to have the best equipment allowed by the rules. In that way, shooters themselves do the research into what was actually used and this preserves the history of our sport; something that all three organizations are very interested in doing...or should be.

In my own research into rest shooting history it became quickly apparent that many clubs had their own set of rules that could vary quite a bit. The National Rifle Club did seem to be the "umbrella" organization and their rules were used by many smaller clubs. However, as no surprise, many of the matches were contested for large amounts of money and the principals came up with some very unique requirements. One definition that is quite different from our current day perception is that any rest that was adjustable for windage or elevation was considered a machine rest. Some matches allowed them, others did not.

Two masters of gamesmanship when it came to rules on a rest match were Horace Warner and H.W. Perry. They frequently went head to head for large amounts of money and the story of their relationship is a fascinating one.

Steve
  
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Tom Baker
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #78 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 11:22am
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SPG,

"head to head for large amounts of money", that's something that's near and dear to me, old buddy.

Kid Baker
  
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Steve Garbe
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #79 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 12:29pm
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Kid,

As you know, I've always said that "there is more to life than money".

Nice to hear that you are still alive...we missed you at Cody.

Steve
  
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Walter  Matera
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Re: Traditional Rifle rules revisited
Reply #80 - Jun 21st, 2013 at 12:55pm
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Steve Garbe wrote on Jun 21st, 2013 at 12:29pm:
Kid,
As you know, I've always said that "there is more to life than money".
Steve


Yeah, you cain't take it with you . . . but you cain't go nowhere without it! Grin
  
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