Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2]  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Barrel matting (Read 801 times)
GT
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2352
Location: Northeast Wyoming
Joined: Jun 28th, 2015
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #15 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 1:46am
Print Post  
A while ago I did some full ribs and a couple of quarter ribs with a knurling process, it stresses the part immensely not something I want to do to a barrel.  I made a couple of knurls, added wavy lines and all.  With what I saw it do to the quarter ribs, the matting on a barrel needs to be cut.  I have a full length tapered ovate barrel I'm making for an English configuration, time added for cutting the matte will be miniscule in comparison.   

I made a couple of stippling punches using a tap with a couple of flutes ground off as my mill, the punch set up in a dividing head to get a diagonal pattern on the face, they still need hardened and tempered - it's a time thing.   Made them while the idea was a fresh thought quite a while ago, just haven't got back to them yet, maybe next month?  2152, you may have motivated me a little bit.  In another case, I filed a few lines in a smaller punch once and used it on a gun stock, with patience it produces an interesting pattern on wood.

Bob,
No I'm not using a guide of any sort.  I did practice a little on the bottom side of this barrel, first with a coarse checkering file, a 12 lpi, then a 16, and I've settled on a 20LPI.  The first few strokes are critical to get things going - a guide there may help some.  A lot of this is you need to pay attention to body motion and alignment of the file.  Stroke is only in one direction and I advance the file about one line with each stroke with pressure focused on the trailing line.  I've been checkering some hammer spurs and lower tangs so this practice is good.  I'm my worst critic and with some experience, I see flaws quickly, both with mine and that done by others.  With a few more miles of checkering I'll get better or I'll care less  Wink - not unlike my woodwork.
GT
  

"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk"  T. A. Edison
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right" M.T.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
RDBallard
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 118
Location: Kansas
Joined: Apr 22nd, 2020
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #16 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 2:00am
Print Post  
a
« Last Edit: Today at 1:41am by RDBallard »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 17931
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #17 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 10:38am
Print Post  
I often wondered if they used some tool similar to those used to roll knurling on knobs and similar steel pieces? Just with a different pattern to do so? Seems like using a tool like a knurling tool mounted in a mill with the barrel on the deck would make the process somewhat easier than any other method.

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bobw
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2073
Location: NW, Iowa
Joined: Mar 19th, 2013
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #18 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 12:04pm
Print Post  
Greg, I’ve done a few hammer spurs, but with just ok results. You are correct about really needing to pay attention!

The gentleman that has showed us a couple guns at Greeley he built, I believe a Mauser Actioned rifle before and a High-Wall last year.  I don’t remember his name now, but I think he taught a gunsmith class at a tech college.  Anyway, the bolt gun had some metal checkering that was very well done.   When I asked how he did it he said completely by hand.  I would really like to sit and talk to him, if he shows up this year.

2152hq, as Greg said, your post is very intriguing.

Lynn, I would like to see/hear what your ideas are but right now I’m not ready to get into barrel matting.  I have my hands full on other projects that I trying to get cleaned up before getting into this Singer build.

Bob
  

Robert Warren
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 17931
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #19 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 12:07pm
Print Post  
bobw wrote on Apr 24th, 2026 at 12:04pm:


Lynn, I would like to see/hear what your ideas are but right now I’m not ready to get into barrel matting.  I have my hands full on other projects that I trying to get cleaned up before getting into this Singer build.

Bob


I'm waiting patiently to see the Singer build! Another great SF gunsmith whose not well known to most.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
westerner
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


deleted posts and threads
record holder.

Posts: 12266
Location: Why, out West of course
Joined: May 29th, 2006
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #20 - Apr 24th, 2026 at 10:23pm
Print Post  
GT wrote on Apr 24th, 2026 at 1:46am:
A while ago I did some full ribs and a couple of quarter ribs with a knurling process, it stresses the part immensely not something I want to do to a barrel.  I made a couple of knurls, added wavy lines and all.  With what I saw it do to the quarter ribs, the matting on a barrel needs to be cut.  I have a full length tapered ovate barrel I'm making for an English configuration, time added for cutting the matte will be miniscule in comparison.  

I made a couple of stippling punches using a tap with a couple of flutes ground off as my mill, the punch set up in a dividing head to get a diagonal pattern on the face, they still need hardened and tempered - it's a time thing.   Made them while the idea was a fresh thought quite a while ago, just haven't got back to them yet, maybe next month?  2152, you may have motivated me a little bit.  In another case, I filed a few lines in a smaller punch once and used it on a gun stock, with patience it produces an interesting pattern on wood.

Bob,
No I'm not using a guide of any sort.  I did practice a little on the bottom side of this barrel, first with a coarse checkering file, a 12 lpi, then a 16, and I've settled on a 20LPI.  The first few strokes are critical to get things going - a guide there may help some.  A lot of this is you need to pay attention to body motion and alignment of the file.  Stroke is only in one direction and I advance the file about one line with each stroke with pressure focused on the trailing line.  I've been checkering some hammer spurs and lower tangs so this practice is good.  I'm my worst critic and with some experience, I see flaws quickly, both with mine and that done by others.  With a few more miles of checkering I'll get better or I'll care less  Wink - not unlike my woodwork.
GT


Tremendous stress on a barrel? The part you were knurling? Does it bend a barrel? Crushes a barrel?
  

A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kootne
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 475
Location: Libby, Mt.
Joined: Mar 6th, 2012
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #21 - yesterday at 12:03am
Print Post  
Take a piece of flat, mount a bump knurl in your Bridgeport quill and roll the knurl into the flat and it will be bent when you take it out. Every one of those divots is inducing stress, that is what Greg is talking about. 
I was going to try a barrel once, but never did. My plan was to use a fence at an angle on my shaper and a cutter like a threading tool. Never got it done before the urge faded so it's still a hypothetical concept. With my 16" shaper it would take 2 set-ups per side and another 2 for the opposite angle.
  

You can't make good decisions without good information.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
GT
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2352
Location: Northeast Wyoming
Joined: Jun 28th, 2015
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #22 - yesterday at 2:02am
Print Post  
Yes, the pieces of bar stock I made the quarter rib and the full ribs out of distorted quite a bit.  I used a Cincinnati #2 mill with a holder for my knurling tool.  I used a diamond roll like Vall had pictured first, I have a couple rolls about an inch diameter.  As I said I made a 2" diameter roll with a figure similar to the Winchester pattern.  Getting down pressure isn't a problem and that mill has 20 some inches of table travel. When I unclamped the rib, it curled about 1/4 to 3/8" if I remember, the rib blank was about 1/2" wide and 3/4" thick.  I used my 24" shaper for the quarter rib, it works well too, but even the piece of 1" keystock I started with showed some bend.  Knurling induces stress, no matter how you slice it.  I've never had an desire to try it on a barrel after seeing what it does to a piece of keystock. I'd encourage someone to give it a whirl and report back to us what your barrel looks and shoots like   Wink  most of the barrels I've bought lately cost quite a bit and I don't feel quite that flush. 

Wes, with that said, my guess is the barrel will bend, the bore will more than likely come out oval?  I have no actual results to report on the barrel dimensions..

For a job once, I had a tube with a 4" inside diameter, 1/4" wall and I needed to shrink the ID a couple thousandths and hone it back to spec.  I knurled the OD with what I thought would be enough, ended up having to bore and then hone things, my thinking gave excessive results.  Grin
GT
  

"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk"  T. A. Edison
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right" M.T.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 17931
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #23 - yesterday at 9:49am
Print Post  
Could give a cutoff piece of barrel a try to test this by checking bore diameter with a pin gauge before and after to see the difference. That should tell you it gets crushed or bent with pressure.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chipmaker
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 375
Location: san diego
Joined: Sep 24th, 2007
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #24 - yesterday at 2:12pm
Print Post  
I've tried a variety of barrel matting  techniques with varying results.
The best so far has been by mill cutting with engraving cutters. A longitudinal cut is the easiest and fastest way, that I've found to produce a matted effect but cross milling, while tedious, is my favorite.
Attached is a photo of a quarter rib matted by cross milling at 30 LPI. The barrel has similar matting but I can't get a clear photo. Maybe after blueing?
Small jobs like hammer spurs can be done with a checkering file but filing a top rib, with and without a fixture, didn't look as nice in my opinion.
I've had no luck using a home shop made knurl and I don't like the look of the single point, rotary tool, power fed at different speeds. 
There was a photo published in the GGCA magazine, that showed the machine used in Ferlach for matting. It looked to be about the size of a milling machine but there was no information on how it worked.
Otto 
« Last Edit: yesterday at 2:17pm by chipmaker »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
GT
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2352
Location: Northeast Wyoming
Joined: Jun 28th, 2015
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #25 - yesterday at 8:14pm
Print Post  
Otto, 
Cutting those at 30 lines per inch does sound tedious. That's an advance each move of .033"?  It looks good, I'm surprised no one has gigged you yet about the  torx screws.   Grin
What's the barrel for?
I sweated my full ribs on and screwed the quarter ribs on, caught grief from my peers about not timing the slots.  Then when I timed the screw heads I timed them crossways and caught grief that they would've looked better lengthwise... Couldn't win Grin Angry tough crowd I used to hang with...
GT
« Last Edit: yesterday at 9:04pm by GT »  

"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk"  T. A. Edison
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right" M.T.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
LRF
Oldtimer
*****
Offline



Posts: 704
Location: MN
Joined: May 8th, 2010
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #26 - yesterday at 9:20pm
Print Post  
bobw wrote on Apr 24th, 2026 at 12:04pm:
......
Lynn, I would like to see/hear what your ideas are but right now I’m not ready to get into barrel matting.  I have my hands full on other projects that I trying to get cleaned up before getting into this Singer build.

Bob

That's cool Bob. Right now I am just enjoying the varied input. I personally have no interest as I said, other then from the engineering end of it. 
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3942
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: Barrel matting
Reply #27 - yesterday at 9:52pm
Print Post  
Gregg, I once had a near-identical looking pair of Colt Single Actions and one always was my favorite. Couldn't quite put my finger one why until I noticed that the screws on the side were aligned on one and catywampus on the other. Not custom, though, just coincidence. No, they weren't a matched pair- different caliber, but visual twins. Other than the one thing.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 
Send TopicPrint