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SteveOKo922
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Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Jun 7th, 2025 at 2:55pm
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Do you all see any significant difference in the positions of your groups or inconsistent groups shooting the same load in summer vs fall or winter? Loads I previously proved for several rifles like my trapdoors, werndl and mauser are throwing wild groups and POI shifts shooting in the midday sun.
  
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oneatatime
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #1 - Jun 7th, 2025 at 3:33pm
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Yes, some powders seem to be more sensitive to temperature. For me, it was IMR 4198. I believe Hodgdons makes mention of some of their powders being less so.
« Last Edit: Jun 7th, 2025 at 6:50pm by oneatatime »  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #2 - Jun 7th, 2025 at 4:35pm
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Hodgdon's "Extreme" series powders are known for their temperature insensitivity. 
Specific examples include Varget, Retumbo, H4831SC, H4350, H4198, H4895, and H4831. 
They are designed to maintain consistent performance in various temperature conditions, crucial for precision shooting. 

When we shot H108 or AA #9 down to -40 F. we only needed to add a tenth grain for cold temepratures below freezing.
  
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oneatatime
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #3 - Jun 7th, 2025 at 6:52pm
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When it gets really cold I guess you just warm the primers over an open fire?
  
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Cbashooter
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #4 - Jun 7th, 2025 at 7:26pm
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lube IMHO is the variable in temperature changes. Some good some bad
  
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boats
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #5 - Jun 8th, 2025 at 8:03am
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My sight iron sight setting club 200 yard offhand matches varies as much as 2 moa below freezing to 90 degrees. Cold morning warming up mid day I may lower the sight 1 moa as it warms up.

It’s either a 38/55 or 32/40 barrel 4227 powder. Target is a steel ram hung on chains. It’s wide, wind not a big issue however it’s 10 moa high. My long run “average” hold is 7 moa.

That means elevation setting to exactly center makes a Difference. Push that 7 moa group higher or lower I will get some narrow misses. 40 shot match is decided by a single shot most times and top 3 finish by 2 targets. Best if shooters factor in temperature setting sights.

It’s not the whole story though. Iron sights with a post or post and bead light will make elevation differences in point of impact. Arpeture sight less so, it’s light error more in group size than elevation. It’s easy to blame differences on one, temperature when it’s the other, light.

Last I have seen the same sight errors and condition changes iron sight small bore prone at 50 meters and  BPCS to 500 yards.

More than you asked for ! 

Boats   



  
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boats
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #6 - Jun 8th, 2025 at 8:20am
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Siting here morning coffee put another observation out there. Rifles I use most two CPA’s accurate with sights capable of precise setting. Before about 1993 shot matches with a Trapdoor. It’s a military rifle with sights that are not able to make precise changes. It puts a pattern on the target not a specific point.

Boats
  
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George Babits
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #7 - Jun 8th, 2025 at 12:13pm
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That's the problem with smokeless powder.   Years ago Bob Hagel  did some comprehensive test on temperature affect on smokless powder hunting loads.   The information is in his book, "Guns, Loads, & Hunting Tips," published by Wolfe Publishing in 1986.  Although he does not include black powder,  in my experience temperature doesn't seem to make much difference with black powder.  If I hunt with a black powder rifle, I load it with black powder.  I guess the lube might still make a difference though.   

George
  
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SteveOKo922
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #8 - Jun 10th, 2025 at 1:18pm
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boats wrote on Jun 8th, 2025 at 8:20am:
Siting here morning coffee put another observation out there. Rifles I use most two CPA’s accurate with sights capable of precise setting. Before about 1993 shot matches with a Trapdoor. It’s a military rifle with sights that are not able to make precise changes. It puts a pattern on the target not a specific point.

Boats


That's the very rifle is was having trouble with. Did a significant load development in the fall and come summer, it's printing way high  similar results with my swissb1851 federal rifle. Way high. It's a good thing hunting season is in November here hopefully everything will settle back
  
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TheLooseMoose
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #9 - Jun 11th, 2025 at 4:54pm
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Drove across Texas to the Whittington Center, New Mexico one summer and found all my match ammo looked like candle sticks as all the SPG lube had melted and ran down the bullet noses and pooled in the bottom of the box while traveling in the bed of the truck in 100+ temps. 

Now…our ammo magazine is an old beer ice chest that we keep cool for match ammo storage during hot conditions.
  
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Kansas Highwall
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shoooting
Reply #10 - Jul 8th, 2025 at 8:17pm
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Maybe not so much of a change in accuracy but definately a change in my body. I remember shooting at the range in 100+ degree temps one day and even in the shade, I managed to down all the water I had with me.
On way home I had to pull over due to the intense pain I was receiving. Yep, I got so dehydrated I passed a kidney stone. Cry
now at my age if it's too cold or too hot I stay home. Grin

  
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bpjack
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #11 - Jul 8th, 2025 at 10:47pm
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I only made it through one day at Spokane a couple of years back when it was at least 108 degrees,  I shot the .22 and .25 ISSA matches with a wet towel on my head, all the while coughing (turns out I had bronchitis). Sue Miller was about to call 911 for me.

Jack
  

ASSRA # 11318
I haven’t lost all my marbles yet but there is definitely a hole in the bag somewhere.
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art_ruggiero
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #12 - Jul 9th, 2025 at 8:18am
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keep in mind that as temps go up or down so does air density  causing more ore less resistance to the bullet   art
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #13 - Jul 10th, 2025 at 9:03am
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I drove to Raton, New Mexico on a couple of occassions when temperatures were up to 110 F.

My bullets in the back of the truck never sloughed off their lube like happens with SPG because they were lubed with Alberta Schuetzen Lube.

When we developed Alberta Schuetzen Lube we tested firing a 100 rounds rapidly at 1,826 fps at 110 F. to demonstrate it's effectiveness at high temperatures.

Alberta Schuetzen Lube was tested at extreme low tempertures since we had Schuetzen competitions at the Spruce Grove, Alberta range when it was -40 F. as well.

Some shooters did minor increases in powder weights at colder temperatures to achieve the same point of impact.

I rarely adjusted my powder weights. 
Useally I just readjusted my sights to compensate for the difference. 

However accuarcy can be affected by many lubes that are not developed for the temperature extremes.
« Last Edit: Jul 10th, 2025 at 9:16am by Schuetzendave »  
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Schutzenbob
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Re: Hot weather vs cool weather shooting
Reply #14 - Jul 10th, 2025 at 11:03am
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I live down here in the lower hotter desert, and I keep my lubed bullets in a refrigerator, and when I drive to Phoenix or Raton, etc., I keep them in an ice chest. It's also a good idea to take some lube along just in case. Also, I find in hot weather the mirage is more intense.
« Last Edit: Jul 10th, 2025 at 9:26pm by Schutzenbob »  
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