Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2  Send TopicPrint
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Ballard hammer (Read 1055 times)
debass
Participating Member
*
Online



Posts: 16
Location: northern California
Joined: Nov 23rd, 2008
Ballard hammer
Apr 6th, 2025 at 7:24pm
Print Post  
I got a new hammer from the Rifle Shoppe, managed to drill the hole in the right place, and fit it to my action. My question is do I need to harden the entire hammer or just case harden the sear notch or leave it as is?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 16733
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #1 - Apr 6th, 2025 at 7:49pm
Print Post  
debass wrote on Apr 6th, 2025 at 7:24pm:
I got a new hammer from the Rifle Shoppe, managed to drill the hole in the right place, and fit it to my action. My question is do I need to harden the entire hammer or just case harden the sear notch or leave it as is?


Did they indicate what metal the hammer is cast from? Was it easy to drill? If you harden it, I'd do the whole hammer and quench in oil.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
debass
Participating Member
*
Online



Posts: 16
Location: northern California
Joined: Nov 23rd, 2008
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #2 - Apr 6th, 2025 at 8:08pm
Print Post  
THey didn't specify, but it was easy to drill and file to shape.  I'll do the entire hammer as you suggest. Thanks
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
jhm
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online



Posts: 1681
Location: georgia
Joined: Sep 4th, 2011
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #3 - Apr 6th, 2025 at 10:52pm
Print Post  
Speaking of Ballard's I have started a kit and have some drawings ordered but would like to get a start while waiting on them. Anyone know the screw thread size for the breech block assy and the lever?


JMH
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 16733
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #4 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 10:52am
Print Post  
jhm wrote on Apr 6th, 2025 at 10:52pm:
Speaking of Ballard's I have started a kit and have some drawings ordered but would like to get a start while waiting on them. Anyone know the screw thread size for the breech block assy and the lever?


JMH


Hopefully Ken Moss will see your post and reply. He knows all the screw sizes since he made screws for almost all single shot rifles. If he doesn't, I have brand new screws I can try and do a thread count gauge on, and measure diameters with my micrometer.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bobw
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1727
Location: NW, Iowa
Joined: Mar 19th, 2013
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #5 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 11:25am
Print Post  
jhm wrote on Apr 6th, 2025 at 10:52pm:
Speaking of Ballard's I have started a kit and have some drawings ordered but would like to get a start while waiting on them. Anyone know the screw thread size for the breech block assy and the lever?


JMH



Lever screw drawing but not sure it’s correct because my hand drawing from a screw I made for a Ballard doesn’t show 40 tpi.  40 seems really fine for that screw.
Bob
  

Robert Warren
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bobw
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1727
Location: NW, Iowa
Joined: Mar 19th, 2013
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #6 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 11:33am
Print Post  
jhm wrote on Apr 6th, 2025 at 10:52pm:
Speaking of Ballard's I have started a kit and have some drawings ordered but would like to get a start while waiting on them. Anyone know the screw thread size for the breech block assy and the lever?


JMH


Here’s the drawing of the block screws.   

I tend to make screws to what I have on hand and custom lengths and diameter for best fit.   

Not sure these drawing are correct in comparison to actual originals.  Obviously the bb link and lever screws are different.  My hand drawing are what were used to fix an actual original.

Be interesting to see what Ken has.
Bob
« Last Edit: Apr 7th, 2025 at 11:40am by bobw »  

Robert Warren
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
jhm
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online



Posts: 1681
Location: georgia
Joined: Sep 4th, 2011
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #7 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 5:11pm
Print Post  
Thanks guys. This will get me started till the drawings get here. With the mail like it is around here it could be anyones guess.



JMH
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ssdave
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1926
Location: Eastern Oregon
Joined: Apr 16th, 2004
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #8 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 10:14pm
Print Post  
That series of drawings is suspect on many details.  Good hints, but not definitive.  The screw sizes were modern "equivalents" that were close, but not necessarily interchangeable.  The guy that reverse engineered them used to post here occasionally, his name was Frank something if I recall correctly.  He was a draftsman, not a machinist, and did the takeoffs from limited examples, maybe even 1.   

On the hardening question:  Yes, the hammer needs to be hardened throughout, not just the sear.  The nose of a hammer needs hardened and then drawn out moderately.  Otherwise it will mushroom and deform in use.  You can draw the hammer nose out more than the sear by polishing the metal bright and heating the hammer nose until it's the appropriate color, (I'd go medium straw, just as purple starts to appear.  Or use temperature crayon, and use the appropriate temperature for the material you're treating.  The heat conducted to the sear notches won't make them as hot; you can draw them out by themselves, but you want to keep them pretty hard.  Maybe not glass hard, but close.  I've had them chip if I didn't draw them out slightly.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
jhm
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online



Posts: 1681
Location: georgia
Joined: Sep 4th, 2011
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #9 - Apr 7th, 2025 at 11:01pm
Print Post  
Dave what threads would you suggest? I was going to use 32tpi on most of them.




JMH
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
KensBullard
Participating Member
*
Offline



Posts: 26
Location: Woodland Wa
Joined: Dec 17th, 2024
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #10 - Apr 8th, 2025 at 12:43am
Print Post  
got my  prints out. but most of the screw sizes on those prints are off from what I came up with the hammer and lever  are .227X40 no tap found. lock screws fore arm screw tang sight screws lever link screw .172 X 40 closes tap is a 6X40 STI tap like in heilcoil. trigger plate screws are .135x42. no taps found. what I found is that Red River and Cody used off the shelf taps to biuld there guns Ken
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
KensBullard
Participating Member
*
Offline



Posts: 26
Location: Woodland Wa
Joined: Dec 17th, 2024
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #11 - Apr 8th, 2025 at 12:46am
Print Post  
JHM you could 12X40 for the lever and hammer and 8X40 for the others some of the engagement is short I would go with 40 TPI. ken
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
jhm
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online



Posts: 1681
Location: georgia
Joined: Sep 4th, 2011
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #12 - Apr 8th, 2025 at 1:51am
Print Post  
Not looking for original fastener sizes cause as you stated you probably couldn't get the taps and dies. I am pretty sure I have both 12x40 and 8x40 taps and dies so thanks for the tip. Going to get started tomorrow. Been cleaning up all the individual parts of sprue and casting lines etc. Rodney casts a good part. I hope the person who bought him out will give as much attention to detail as he did. Thanks for the help.


JMH
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Deadeye Bly
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1089
Location: Stephens City
Joined: Feb 25th, 2011
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #13 - Apr 8th, 2025 at 9:22am
Print Post  
I like to make new screws to fit the hole that they go in regardless of the nominal size. All Ballard screws seem to be 40 tpi regardless of the diameter. 

ss dave is correct on hardening. I like to temper to full straw then clamp the lower part of the hammer with the sear notches in smooth steel jaws in a vice and temper the top to first blue. This keeps the lower part from getting too hot.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 16733
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Ballard hammer
Reply #14 - Apr 8th, 2025 at 12:36pm
Print Post  
All the block screws and one of the link screws are the same threads. Just different lengths, and on the link screw a different length and head. Hammer screw and Lever screws are each unique size and length.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 
Send TopicPrint