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gunlaker
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most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Feb 8th, 2023 at 5:24pm
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I have a new CPA silhouette rifle on order.  It's going to be done quite soon.  It's primary purpose is to experiment with a 1:12 twist 38-50 Remington Hepburn cartridge to see if it can outdo my super accurate Shiloh in .40-65.   I decided to also add barrels in 32-40 ( because it's pretty much a guaranteed thing that a CPA in 32-40 will shoot ) and also a barrel in 30-40 because I've never owned one.   

But I've been thinking... What chambering that CPA offers has the best accuracy potential for fixed ammo?  Plain base velocities so no gas checks, no antimony alloys, no breech seating.  100 & 200 yards.

Chris.
 
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #1 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 5:37pm
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I purchased a CPA rifle that had both a .40-60 Maynard and a .40-65 WCF barrel.

The original owner worked with Ron Long and Steve Garbe who both argued their caliber won competitions.

So he made two barrels to test it out.

After I purchased the rifle I discovered the .40-60 Maynard shot a slight bit better.

The straighter walled cartridge had better bullet concentricity.

The .40-60 Maynard CPA would also outshoot my .40-65 Shiloh Sharps - more so on the Rams.

The .40-60 Maynard performed remarkably well for this BP Silhouette article including beating out all the .45-70 and .45-90 rifles.




« Last Edit: Feb 8th, 2023 at 6:43pm by Schuetzendave »  
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Mick B
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #2 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 5:43pm
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I have had a CPA in the following calibers, 45-70, 45-90, 40-60 Maynard, and 40-65, the 40-60 Maynard shot  the best for me.
Mike.
  
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gunlaker
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #3 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 6:11pm
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Oh, I forgot to add that I'm talking about smokeless powder.   I have enough very accurate black powder rifles.

Chris.
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #4 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 6:25pm
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If you are shooting 300 yards or less with smokeless powder you need a .32 caliber shooting a heavy 235 grain spitzer bullet in a 11.5:1 or 12:1 twist barrel.

As you know I strongly recommend a .32 RKS for breech seating or a .32-40 for fixed ammunition.

I also had a .32-40 for may CPA (16:1 twist) but I disposed of it since I had three .32 RKS rifles that performed with great excellence and it never had a tight enough twist for my liking.

I live by the rule heavier bullets have much better Kinetic Energy and are far less susceptible to wind drift but of coarse you need a tighter twist to stabilize them.
« Last Edit: Feb 8th, 2023 at 6:41pm by Schuetzendave »  
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gunlaker
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #5 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 6:49pm
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Actually Dave I didn't know you recommended the 32-40 for fixed.  I've played just a little with fixed in one of my .32-40 highwalls and never got back to it.  I used a tapered bullet seated out as far as possible with IMR-4227.   It looks like the rifle might be able to shoot a little over MOA for a ten shot group @ 100m, but to get it to shoot well I had to cam the loaded cartridge into the rifling with one of those aluminum tools that Steve Rhoades used to sell.  

What sort of bullet design do you think is worth looking at for fixed?  Assuming a 1:14 twist barrel with a 1.5 degree leade. 

thanks,

Chris.   
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #6 - Feb 8th, 2023 at 7:02pm
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You need to design the proper leade to match the bullet you use.
For a 14:1 twist I had the best results with a 205 grain Paul Jones spitzer - appropriate length and center of balance. 

Once you have selected the right length bullet you need for your selected barrel twist then you get Ron Smith to determine the degree of leade and the length of leade to minimize bullet jump for the bullet you have selected.

I think he uses only a 1/2 degree leade for the long pointed spitzer - but I leave that up to the expert to determine what is best.

The first rifle I started with in the Schuetzen game back in 1993 was a 14:1 twist .32-40 but as you know I progressed to heavier bullets and tighter twist barrels with .32 calibers.

The best way of testing the improved performance is compare the heavier bullets in tighter twist barrels against the slower twist barrels throwing lighter bullets at 300 yards under gusting wind conditions.

The Alberta Schuetzen Guild used to have competitions at 300 yards when everyone else was just plinking at 200 yards.  
That is why Ron Smith continually started producing tighter twist barrels and Paul Jones corresponded by making us longer heavier bullets.

If you had to cam your cartridge in, your bullet was probably extended too far out in the case or you never flattened out your case mouth bell.

I would remove the decapping stem in my FL sizer and squeeze my mouth bell flat after I had seated the bullet to the correct depth.

« Last Edit: Feb 8th, 2023 at 10:25pm by Schuetzendave »  
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calledflyer
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #7 - Feb 9th, 2023 at 8:55am
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I worked to see what results I could get with fixed in my highwall 32-.40. I tried at first to get the bullet as far out, into the rifling as I could to approach the breech seated arrangement. Eventually I discovered that while jamming the thing in there, I was moving the bullet back into the case on some rounds and less, or not at all on others. Not a recipe for accuracy. I went back and began to seat them so they just made firm contact with the rifling and things grew much better. I ended up with a lot of the loads at just over an inch with, now and again, one that went well under a MOA. 
The barrel is an original, the powder doing the best was 4227, and the range of bullets were cast fairly hard in most cases- that was part of what I was doing- shooting up a bunch of wheel weights.
 
Now I take a couple of boxes to the range and let 'guests' shoot 'em so they don't need to be more confused by breech seating along with all else different from their 'regular' and familiar guns.
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: most accurate CPA chambering for fixed ammo
Reply #8 - Feb 9th, 2023 at 9:49am
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And when shooting the heavier bullets in the .32-40 we found using H108, AA #9, AA 4100, WC820 or MP300 would perform better than 4227.

While 4227 is close in burn rate it may not meter quite as well out of a powder measure.
The finer balled powders meter exceptionally well.

Start with 12.0 grains and work up to a higher load as required and as you know my preference is for a 20:1 alloy.
« Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2023 at 2:21pm by Schuetzendave »  
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