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16" twist in 32/40 (Read 4067 times)

Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1023 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #30 - Feb 3^rd, 2023 at 10:02pm	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2023 at 9:01pm: Not really and it actually all does boil down to the actual time of flight. Which part is not really, and why?


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #31 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 10:03am	Print Post
	Just hasn't been my own long term personal experience.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1023 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #32 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 11:11am	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 10:03am: Just hasn't been my own long term personal experience. So because “you haven’t experienced it”, tho many others have, is wrong. Yet, 3X bullet diameter is the perfect bullet for a 16 twist 32-40 should be taken as gospel because you have experienced that. Even tho you can’t explain how you got that number(other than some one told you) and freely admit if you change the bullet shape, it will no longer be true. And it can’t be applied to other calibers or even twist rates, velocities or barrel lengths of the same cartridge. Somewhere in there, is a disconnect. Trust but verify, seems to be applicable here. Always good to share ideas with you, but without being able to express the what and why of them, or lay down a challenge based on fact instead of feeling, it’s tough to gain any knowledge. And that’s the whole point of sharing ideas.


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Premod70 Oldtimer Offline Posts: 853 Location: North Carolina Joined: Jan 16^th, 2016	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #33 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 3:37pm	Print Post
	Dellet wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 11:11am: JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 10:03am: Just hasn't been my own long term personal experience. So because “you haven’t experienced it”, tho many others have, is wrong. Yet, 3X bullet diameter is the perfect bullet for a 16 twist 32-40 should be taken as gospel because you have experienced that. Even tho you can’t explain how you got that number(other than some one told you) and freely admit if you change the bullet shape, it will no longer be true. And it can’t be applied to other calibers or even twist rates, velocities or barrel lengths of the same cartridge. Somewhere in there, is a disconnect. Trust but verify, seems to be applicable here. Always good to share ideas with you, but without being able to express the what and why of them, or lay down a challenge based on fact instead of feeling, it’s tough to gain any knowledge. And that’s the whole point of sharing ideas. Facts are worthless without the experience to know their worth. So far this thread has no facts that trumps Mr. Louis’s personal knowledge, jmho.


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #34 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 3:58pm	Print Post
	Premod70 I just didn't want to get into a pissing match. I have personally shot 100's of various bullets through an Ohler 43 Ballistic System and I just don't want to argue over those results with someone who has not. Not sure if anyone here has also done the same but the results do not lie. With that being said one can actually confirm a bullets stability by it's actual time of flight and comparing that to several bullets, flat nose, spitzer's, round nose, truncated nose and other individual designs.
	« Last Edit: Feb 4^th, 2023 at 4:08pm by JLouis »
	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #35 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 4:34pm	Print Post
	Probably should have also mentioned that these were all bullets for a 32-40 and also being breech seated. I have tried to share a ballistic printout here in the past but is also very, very hard to see everything that has to be programmed into prior to being used. Current, temp, altitude, density altitude, barometric pressure, humidity and on and on. All tests also included ten shots and that is probably enough of an explanation for someone to get a feel for the actual facts / results that were being provided. Sierra Bullets and others were also using this same system in their various tunnel tests back at that time.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Premod70 Oldtimer Offline Posts: 853 Location: North Carolina Joined: Jan 16^th, 2016	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #36 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 5:13pm	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 3:58pm: Premod70 I just didn't want to get into a pissing match. Lol, John, I doubt you could quote Scripture without wrankling feathers on some of this forum’s members. Thanks for staying with us snd sharing your wisdom!


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Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1023 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #37 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 5:20pm	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 4:34pm: Probably should have also mentioned that these were all bullets for a 32-40 and also being breech seated. I have tried to share a ballistic printout here in the past but is also very, very hard to see everything that has to be programmed into prior to being used. Current, temp, altitude, density altitude, barometric pressure, humidity and on and on. All tests also included ten shots and that is probably enough of an explanation for someone to get a feel for the actual facts / results that were being provided. Sierra Bullets and others were also using this same system in their various tunnel tests back at that time. We agree more than we disagree. If that’s no fun. But I can absolutely guarantee you that Sierra is not using a formula that is bore diameter x Y = longest bullet you can use. I asked a simple couple of questions, answered as expected. It seems to work for a limited number of bullet shapes, in a certain caliber with a certain twist. You have no knowledge of how that specific formula came to be, and know way of applying it to any other application. There is no argument there. What is interesting is that now you say you are using basically the formulas and inputs that I use, which you basically said were wrong. When I asked what I posted that was inaccurate your response JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 10:03am: Just hasn't been my own long term personal experience. So your experience is that if you do something it’s good, if someone else does they same thing, they’re wrong. Basically you’re arguing with yourself and using me as your fall guy. Much appreciated


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #38 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 5:40pm	Print Post
	( So your experience is that if you do something it’s good, if someone else does they same thing, they’re wrong ) Not at all the Ballistic System just does not Lie !

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1023 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #39 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 5:56pm	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Feb 4^th, 2023 at 5:40pm: ( So your experience is that if you do something it’s good, if someone else does they same thing, they’re wrong ) Not at all the Ballistic System just does not Lie ! This is where you should either point out anything I said that was inaccurate as you implied, or apologize for doing so.


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #40 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 7:49pm	Print Post
	Dellet I no longer shoot or compete and I actually do not have the time to spend on this childish BS. My own personal accomplishments speak for themselves. I have set my own goals and I have now achieved them all. It is now pretty obvious that I cannot help you but hopefully somehow I can still help others here.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Rebel Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4292 Location: Rockets and Race Cars Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #41 - Feb 4^th, 2023 at 8:35pm	Print Post
	Sonny's off her meds again. Aaron

	WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #42 - Feb 5^th, 2023 at 5:20pm	Print Post
	Not sure why you are now involved and I was in no way trying to demean Dellet at all. We all have different personal experiences, he has his and I have mine. But it also not worth arguing over by any means or for it to just end up damaging our own relationships.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11323 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #43 - Feb 5^th, 2023 at 6:32pm	Print Post
	John, when you mentioned the 3-1 ratio, that is to get one in the ballpark for length and weight wasn't it?

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10628 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: 16" twist in 32/40 Reply #44 - Feb 5^th, 2023 at 7:04pm	Print Post
	Joe exactly and that is what it was. Going beyond that and having shot 100's of 10 shot groups through the Ohler Ballistic system I was just trying to share the actual results. As you might or might not know I spent a year going out twice a week with a personal intent of setting a new ASSRA Record. Also as you may or may not know after trying several various bullets, powder, loads, primers etc.and while also shooting through the Ohler 43 ballistic system. I was able to accomplish it with a cylindrical Pope Style / Darr flat nose bullet of all things. My only point was I personally do not believe that I could have done the same by using some kind of computer generated program but only by the actual real time results. I also believe that you had mentioned that you also had a similar experience with the same type of bullet yourself.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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