Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 11 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) ML schuetzen resources (Read 69731 times)
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #60 - Dec 10th, 2009 at 1:02pm
Print Post  
duh, it's out in it's case in the trunk of my car,  under about 6 inches of snow and howling wind and near zero visibility  wind chill -15.  maybe if I really work at it I'll get up enough ambition to dig my way out to it and bring it in.

I finally figured out a way to check the bore/groove--I think.

I did take a couple more snaps of the rear sight the other night.  guess I'll have to down load them and figure out which is worth posting.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Redwing
Oldtimer
*****
Offline



Posts: 586
Location: Canton
Joined: Nov 4th, 2007
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #61 - Dec 10th, 2009 at 7:25pm
Print Post  
Hey DWS !!!

Be careful about bringing them cold guns into a warm house..

Ed....
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #62 - Dec 16th, 2009 at 7:57pm
Print Post  
Ed you asked earlier about some closeups of the rear sight.  Here are 4 different views.  Have you ever seen one like this?  That new M/L schuetzen Joe has coming looks to me, (in the photo) like it has the same sight.    several in the Rowe book look the same.   It's almost like there was some sort of MVA or Axtel-type business that was making them for the 'smiths back then,  probably the same for trigger guards and buttplates,   but then maybe there were a lot more small scale local casting shops back then than there are now.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
westerner
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


deleted posts and threads
record holder.

Posts: 11345
Location: Why, out West of course
Joined: May 29th, 2006
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #63 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 12:22am
Print Post  
The style and lines on your rifle are works of art DW.  Smiley


                    Joe
  

A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
stebbinsgr
Ex Member


Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #64 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 5:36am
Print Post  
Beautiful percussion Schuetzen.  The trigger guard appears to be silver plated.  Gee I wonder where Harry Pope got the idea to make such strange looking levers for some the Stevens Schuetzen rifles.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #65 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 7:13am
Print Post  
I'm pretty sure they are nickle-plated.  the butt-plate is the same and the removable knob/screw on the upper prong has a wear spot through to the base metal, as does the trigger guard removal knob. 

  If they were silver I'd expect a degree of tarnish in the corners,  Its been hanging on a wall for years and shows no evidence of recent polishing.   
That trigger guard is indeed nice. It also feels very natural in the offhand position.  I keep leafing through the Rowe book comparing features on the rifles shown to my Rudolph Grimm rifle.  There is a lot of variety when it comes to the guards.  While Grimm was a Chicago 'smith this guard looks a whole lot more like the ones on a few of the eastern guns.  I'd love to figure out how to get a replica of it, and the butt-plate, cast.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Green_Frog
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


"It ain't easy being green"
ASSRA Life #281

Posts: 3965
Location: Lynchburg, VA
Joined: Apr 18th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #66 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 9:00am
Print Post  
DW, from your recent PM, and your comment in this thread, I assume you are noticing how much this trigger guard resembles the Walker Hepburn lever (wonder where that idea came from?) and how very comfortable it is to shoot.  Now you know why I have the lever I do on MY high-wall schuetzen rifle.  Wink  Have you checked TotW to see whether they have that trigger guard to then cut off and adapt to other apps?

Froggie
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #67 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 11:04am
Print Post  
froggie,  I've had the new TOTW catalogue, either in front of me or in my briefcase for the past couple weeks.  now that my muzzleloader genes are getting fired up with this percusion schuetzen I've been really missing the flintlock musket I "lost" in my divorce some years back and now I'm REALLY seriously thinking of ordering a bunch of parts before year end to recreate it.

They sure have a bunch of trigger guards for certain, but nothing like the one on my rifle.  they have a rather bloated clunky looking "pope style" in waxcast steel as well as a nicer looking "S" & "C" style ML schuetzen guard in brass or steel but nothing coming even close to the one on my rifle.  I know someone has cast the Walker/Hepburn in the past.   I'd like to find one of them too, for a totally different project.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schutzenbob
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online


Rheinisch-Westfälisc
hen Sprengstoff-Fabriken

Posts: 1988
Location: Nightingale, California
Joined: Oct 24th, 2005
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #68 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 11:41am
Print Post  
DW

The Gunsmiths in Wisconsin, Illinois, etc., must have had a particular common design that they were building, because the rifle I have is marked George Beuttenmuller, Chicago, and it’s very similar, the only differences are in the small details. I’m pleased to see the rear tang sight, ‘cause mine didn’t come with one, so I had to make one and now I have to make another. 

Bob

PS in one of the pictures it appears that there's a hole ahead of the triggerguard for a palm rest. 
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2009 at 12:18pm by Schutzenbob »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #69 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 12:39pm
Print Post  
Rowe seems to feel that there were 3 basic schools of percussion schuetzen 'style"  eastern, midwestern, and california.   But looking at the examples photographed for his book I believe there were regional subsets.  In a non-critical way I wonder how many he viewed that did not make it into the book,  and how many others are still out there.   Having edited more than a few pictorial books I wonder how and what criteria he used in his selections.
  I personally suspect that there may be more out there to learn about the antecedents of our ASSRA-style cartridge schuetzen sport.

Bob: Thats what I've assumed as well.  It must be drilled and tapped for a palmrest of some sort. 
 I'd love to know what else would have been in the shooting kit for this rifle.  Mould,? female plunger starter to fit the muzzle recess?  loading rod(s)?  (I suspect the one currently under the barrel is basically a cleaning rod)  some sort of powder container/measure/flask?  What kind of container would the caps have been in?

Rowe shows several variations on palm-rests, including a strange inverted horseshoe one that looks real awkward to me.
Personally I shoot my single shots off my left hand, my forearm vertical, gripping the action with my hand.  I've never been able to find or set up a palmrest that feels as solid.  I guess a lot depends on you own unique body structure.
If you decide you want to make a rear sight like that one PM me.
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2009 at 12:48pm by QuestionableMaynard8130 »  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schutzenbob
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online


Rheinisch-Westfälisc
hen Sprengstoff-Fabriken

Posts: 1988
Location: Nightingale, California
Joined: Oct 24th, 2005
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #70 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 9:35pm
Print Post  
DW,

I think this is very close to your tang sight, just a modern version, I would guess that yours was made in about 1840, so diopters haven't changed much in 170 years;

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Bob

PS What you have to do is to click on the url and then look to the left and find "Diopter für Scheibenbüchen," then click on that and look for the sight that says "Tunnel-Diopter."
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2009 at 9:48pm by Schutzenbob »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
podufa
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 182
Location: Maine
Joined: Dec 30th, 2007
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #71 - Dec 18th, 2009 at 4:06am
Print Post  
amoskeagauctions.com has one in the Leland D. Schlegal collection in March 2010. It has a palm rest.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #72 - Dec 18th, 2009 at 6:45am
Print Post  
Bob,  according to Rowe  R. Grimm, Chicago is listed in the 1880s.

 that link shows a diopter sight that does look a lot similar--minus the elevating screw that appears to be on the left side.
I wish, not for the first time since I got involved in this game, I'd studied German rather than other languages in school.  It looks like they were listing it at 200 EU.----- 600-800$ or something like that.  Dang.  Too bad Sergio doesn't reproduce some of these sights too.

that Amoskeag Auction looks to have some FINE and FANCY single shots.  I'll bet even the auction catalogue will cost and arm and a leg.  that type of palm rest is also shown in Rowe's book, It appears to have been the most common form in the ones he published.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schutzenbob
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Online


Rheinisch-Westfälisc
hen Sprengstoff-Fabriken

Posts: 1988
Location: Nightingale, California
Joined: Oct 24th, 2005
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #73 - Dec 18th, 2009 at 12:26pm
Print Post  
DW,

This is an aprox. translation;

Standard aperture sight milled from steel for muzzleloading schuetzen rifle. Elevation and windage adjustments are made with precisely milled dovetail slots, with 6mm square shaft for fitting into the upper tang, the sight-key is included. Price $300.00 US

Bob
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4143
Location: Berrien Springs, MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: ML schuetzen resources
Reply #74 - Dec 18th, 2009 at 5:19pm
Print Post  
This is just a note to take a look at a post I'm going to put in the For Sale section.

Wayne
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 11
Send TopicPrint