I am getting ready to load ammo for my Westley Richard 1871 Express rifle in 500 No.2 Express. The bore is Whitworth rifled. If I can make this gun shoot I hope to use it on my bear hunt to Manitoba this September.

I am concerned about the shooting round bullets in the polygonal Whitworth bore. I am asking for your opinions on this.

The bullets I have available are as follows.

1. CBE .510 440 mould. This seems the safest option shooting malleable round bullets in a polygonal bore.

2. Woodleigh .510 440 grain RN SN. These bullets have a thinner jacket designed for Black powder express rifles. I would think they should be fine in a Whitworth bore. I have 55 of these bullets.

3. Barnes Original .510 450 grain. An unknown to me.


Would like to hear your opinions on these bullets suitability a polygonal bore.

FWIW, i will be cross posting this question else where to get additional opinions.

My research so far indicates Whitworth rifling of the  Muzzle loaders was different than that of the breechloaders. Mine of course is a 8 groove breech loader.

Here is mine,

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I am  looking at groove diameter jacketed bullet in this bore and any reasons why I shouldn't.

waiting for James Bond to walk across the breech end- isn't that bassakwards of the movies?

The old Barnes bullets could be had in a thin and a thick jacket. This was in the late 60's when the word was that the copper jackets were made by using a Jeep to stretch the copper tubing. IIRC, the .035 was the thin.

Here the latest that i have learned on this.

A lot of people know about Whitworth  Hex bore, not many know about his other  barrels-especially the octagonal ones.

THe nickel based copper tube bullet for this cartridge were a nickel gas check and copper tube down the center of the bullet to aid expansion.

The current Barnes originals, per  Barnes are .035" thick copper jacket.

This barrel slugs .501 minor diameter-across the flats.  .527 major diameter, across the corners.

Paper patch would not be more correct, it was just one of the options at the time.

Hawk does offer a .515 diameter bullet. Close, but not close enough.

I have order .527 mould.

If James Bond was a  Victorian, you might see him in the bore...

calledflyer wrote on Feb 20^th, 2025 at 9:57am:


A long time ago I took a dizzy blonde out to a real fancy restaurant near Seatac airport. Fish at about eighty bucks a plate, two waiters in white tuxs with towels over their arms. Classy joint. This dizzy blonde is wearing a leather dress and one side was black while the other was white. Her top was matching but opposite and black and white checkered leather cap. There was at least a dozen people waiting for tables so we had to wait. The hostess, a young blonde chick asks for a name so I said, Bond, James Bond. She writes it down. Twenty minutes later she comes in and says, Bond, James Bond! As we walked by this guy waiting, he remarks, "way to go double O". I had way to much to drink at dinner and was lucky to have held together.  I love those old James Bond movies. 

oneatatime wrote on Feb 24^th, 2025 at 5:55pm:


I keep it in case my right eye goes bad on me.

Easier said than done...

I think it was pig skin....

I had to shoot this gun.

I loaded up 5 rounds with Barnes originals .510, 450 grain bullets and some Varget.   I shot these standing over tripod stick at a red Leupold target at 25 yards.   

All my shooting and gun life I have listened to the old guys whine about having a hard time seeing the sights.  Now that I am one of them, I "see" what they were whining talking about. Even with corrective cataract surgery things are better, just not best. It was difficult to get a clearly defined sight picture.  Worn sights and red target, did not get me a lot of clear definition.

I fired 3 shots into 3 inches, centered but 7 inches high from point of aim. 
Not anything stellar.  But definitely showing potential.

I let a 15 year old kid with young eyes fire the last two rounds.  His first round went into my group.  The second round he fired was 8 inches low and right-a classic jerk the trigger, buck the shoulder  shot.  We all got a good laugh at this-his dad caught it all on video.  But the kid was all smiles getting to fire this 150 year old classic Indian Tiger rifle.

Time for some serious range work.  I have wait for fire season to be over.  Right now wildfires are burning out by the gun club.

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