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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration (Read 17153 times)
bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #180 - Feb 7th, 2025 at 11:10am
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After the discussion of the lower grip line yesterday, which I agree was wrong, I made some changes.  Here are two photo for comparision, the first was done on Monday, second yesterday.  Lots of erasing!  The change was so subtle that I'm not sure they would be noticed, so I have drawn arrows on the second showing the major areas of change.  I think the very slight change at the bottom by moving the line back made a big difference in the flow.

Since I feel comfortable with the grip line now I started making the fixture for bending the tang as shown in photo 3.  Before bending I still need to thin the tang more.
Bob
  

Robert Warren
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Chuckster
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #181 - Feb 7th, 2025 at 12:50pm
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Excellent discussion. Thanks all. Learning something.
Had not thought of using a teardrop pistol grip for the transition. Comes across very well.
Chuck
  
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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #182 - Feb 12th, 2025 at 6:57pm
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Moved on to the extractor today.  I got it laid out, machined, filed and partially fitted.  

The first picture shows one step, of the many, in the machining of the extractor.

Second and third pictures of the finished extractor.  Still needs fitting and polishing.

Fourth is the extractor setting in the frame, and in the slot that was discussed earlier.  Red arrow.

This last picture shows the extractor, setting in its normal position, in the trigger frame (red arrow).  The screw, with the red arrow pointing to it, supports the extractor.  The screw runs through the action frame and threads into the trigger frame.  The supporting, or pivot pin, for the extractor is part of this screw.
Bob



  

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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #183 - Feb 13th, 2025 at 10:40am
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Bob, I just want to reiterate how much I appreciate you taking the time to document and explain your work.  It's very informative and I really enjoy following your progress.  Thank you!

Joe
  
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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #184 - Feb 13th, 2025 at 7:55pm
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Thanks Joe.

Right or wrong, I bent the tang today.   
Will still need trimming to length.
Bob
  

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MrTipUp
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #185 - Feb 13th, 2025 at 9:20pm
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I have followed all your builds and have formed the opinion that you never do anything "wrong" but do occasionally have"correctable oopsies".  This is going to be one impressive rifle when you're done!

Bill Lawrence
  
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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #186 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 12:03pm
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Have a question for those that have worked on Hepburns.

The small screw #4 in my photo.  What does it do?  

I had originally, and mentioned it before, thought it had something to do with the rebounding hammer.  I partially assembled the original yesterday to see what this screw did, but I’m not certain what it does now.  I would say it has nothing to do with the rebounding hammer because that function is handled in the hammer and main spring design.

It does not hold anything in place but looks like maybe the hammer roller might have contact it.  The original screw was bent when first disassembled, I showed a picture if it earlier in this thread.  To me it appears that the only function might be to stop the upward travel of the main spring.  This would only come into play though, when the breech block was removed. But, this make no sense since the main spring would be remover with the breech block in this gun.

I’m really at a loss to its function, but every Hepburn picture I find has the screw, so it must be, or was important, in the regular Hepburns.

Is it possibly a carry over from the standard Hepburn and not needed on this gun?
Any thoughts?
Bob
  

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marlinguy
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #187 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 12:24pm
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Isn't that the mainspring hold down pin? It keeps the mainspring from over traveling or rising too high on Hepburns.
  

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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #188 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 12:50pm
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Vall, could be.  Never seen an action with a main spring over travel stop screw.  So, I’m showing my ignorance on the subject. 

I will look closer again today, but I’m not sure why this would be necessary, on this gun, with the main spring running under the roller and hammer.  It appears everything would stop when the hammer hits the breech block.  But, like I say, the screw has been hit by something, so…..?
Bob
  

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Chuckster
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #189 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 1:16pm
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That screw is the main spring stop screw on a Hepburn which allows the hammer to rebound and retract the firing pin.
Some repro Hepburn's have done a slight re-design that eliminates the need for that screw. Not sure about your Walker.
Chuck
  
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #190 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 6:26pm
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All my #1 rollers have the same screw. Stops main spring over travel….


Tom Klinger
  
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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #191 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 6:56pm
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Tom, Interesting on the #1 roller having the screw also.

The following is going to really bore some of you. Grin   
I'm going to attempt to explain how this gun rebounds. It is actually very simple but it will take some work to get it adjusted properly in the real world.

When I'm done I would be interested in hearing what everyone think the value of the over travel screw is.  I'm putting it in this gun but still not convinced it is needed as you shall see.
  

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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #192 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 7:17pm
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So I spent a couple hours today looking at this original gun and the rebounding hammer operation.

The following couple posts will explains, as well as I can, how it works.  Here we go!

In the first two picture I left out the screw which everyone calls the spring over travel stop, this is so we can see what I am talking about.   

In this first photo the hammer is in the rebounded position and, at this point the trigger has dropped into the half cock notch.  You can see the spring roller is resting against the spring.

In the second photo the hammer is in what I am calling the fired position, at this point its face is against the breech block and just fired the gun.  You can see there is now a gap between the roller and the spring.

The next two pictures have the stop screw installed.

In the third photo I am again showing the hammer in the rebounded position.  As shown where the arrow is pointing, between the screw and the spring, there is a gap.

In this last photo for this post I am showing the hammer in the fired position.  Note that there is still a gap, although much smaller than before in the rebounded position, between the spring and the stop screw.

I'll show more in the next post.
Bob

  

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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #193 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 7:44pm
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These next pictures are all the related parts, out where they can be seen better, and hopefully I'll be able explain what is happening.

In this first picture I am again showing the hammer in the rebounded position.  You can just see the tip of the spring coming through the front of the trigger.  And the roller is contacting the spring at the rear.

In the second photo the hammer is still in the rebounded position, but is a better picture of the tip of the spring, and as can be seen there is no gap between the spring and hammer.

These first two pictures show the spring pressure between the front and back equalized and holding the hammer in a neutral or rebounded position.

This third picture is shown with the hammer in the fired position. As can be seen the roller has lifted off the spring leaving a gap.  This is probably the reason the stop screw is needed.  I just realized there is lots of pressure on the that spring at this point.

In this last picture, again in the fired position, showing the tip of the spring, at the front of the hammer, applying pressure to the hammer.

So once the hammer hits the firing pin and breech block, the foreword motion stops. Then, the spring tip putting pressure on the front of the hammer, pushes the hammer back until the pressure equalized between the tip and the roller, letting the trigger sear enter the half cock notch and positively holding the hammer in place.

Hopefully this all make sense!
Bob


  

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bobw
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Re: Next Project, Hepburn Walker Patent Configuration
Reply #194 - Feb 14th, 2025 at 7:51pm
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Since I was now comfortable with the stop screw today, I went ahead and put the hole in the frame for it.  Photo 1.

Since this screw hole was holding me back from cutting away the extra steel around the upper tang.  Once it was done, I went ahead and cut away all of the steel.  Tangs are still being left long for now.
Bob
  

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