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4570mike
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What's a Helm?
Oct 2nd, 2023 at 1:45pm
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I have a Cody Ballard High Wall that is described as a "Helm" style or pattern.

I've looked at a couple references I have and the only thing I can find are notations to butt plates.

There was a shooter named Helm from New York, but couldn't find anything connecting him to butt plates.

Anyone know the origin of the term "Helm" and what it applies to?

Thanks,

Mike.

  
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Tom_Trevor assra life no.71
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #1 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 2:21pm
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Helm shot a 75 in a Schuetzen three shot match and Winchester was so impressed they named a buttplate after him.
  
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4570mike
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #2 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 4:03pm
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Tom_Trevor assra life no.71 wrote on Oct 2nd, 2023 at 2:21pm:
Helm shot a 75 in a Schuetzen three shot match and Winchester was so impressed they named a buttplate after him.


Thanks!

Amazing what three shots can get you Wink

Mike.
  
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #3 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 6:13pm
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Tom_Trevor assra life no.71 wrote on Oct 2nd, 2023 at 2:21pm:
Helm shot a 75 in a Schuetzen three shot match and Winchester was so impressed they named a buttplate after him.

Isn't there also a Helm pattern lever?
  
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bpjack
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #4 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 6:49pm
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How many shots did the lever take?
  

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rollingblock
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #5 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 7:22pm
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A: a lever or wheel controlling the rudder of a ship for steering
B:broadly, the entire apparatus for steering a ship  Grin
  
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calledflyer
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #6 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 7:23pm
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Amazing what three shots can get you Wink

In most states three shots will get you a dui.
  
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RDBallard
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #7 - Oct 2nd, 2023 at 10:40pm
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Smoke wrote on Oct 2nd, 2023 at 6:13pm:
Tom_Trevor assra life no.71 wrote on Oct 2nd, 2023 at 2:21pm:
Helm shot a 75 in a Schuetzen three shot match and Winchester was so impressed they named a buttplate after him.

Isn't there also a Helm pattern lever?

I think that's what is referred to as a spur lever
  
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nineteen76
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #8 - Oct 3rd, 2023 at 7:48am
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( .)( .) & ll*llll

“Rack and Pinion”?!
  
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TRowe
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #9 - Oct 3rd, 2023 at 10:09am
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Helm was George Helm, a California shooter that designed the butt plate. Quite a story behind his three-shot 75 score is in the Stevens-Pope books. Winchester was so impressed with the customized Hi-walls used by the California shooters in one of the Glendale Bundesfests that they came out with their own Schuetzen rifle and fine double set triggers in 1897.
  
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rkba2nd
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #10 - Oct 3rd, 2023 at 11:59am
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The Helm to me, looked as though the designer should have measured twice.
  

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4570mike
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #11 - Oct 3rd, 2023 at 12:33pm
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rkba2nd wrote on Oct 3rd, 2023 at 11:59am:
The Helm to me, looked as though the designer should have measured twice.


The documents I received with the rifle indicated the original owner returned the butt plate and had the prongs altered and re-cased.
So, it's been "cut-twice"  Roll Eyes
  
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4570mike
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #12 - Oct 3rd, 2023 at 12:39pm
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TRowe wrote on Oct 3rd, 2023 at 10:09am:
Helm was George Helm, a California shooter that designed the butt plate. Quite a story behind his three-shot 75 score is in the Stevens-Pope books. Winchester was so impressed with the customized Hi-walls used by the California shooters in one of the Glendale Bundesfests that they came out with their own Schuetzen rifle and fine double set triggers in 1897.


The CB paper work describes the rifle as an "1885 Helm Schuetzen".  They must have adopted the name from the Winchester model.
Thanks for your input!
Mike.
  
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #13 - Oct 23rd, 2023 at 2:14pm
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Just to complete the circle, the earliest factory standard high wall Schuetzen rifles followed the “Helm Pattern” with a distinctively shaped stock having the hooked buttplate shown earlier in this thread, the wide spaced DSTs enclosed in a rather simple lever with a finger hook, and usually the so-called “tuning fork” palm rest.  AFAIK, these were all made on the early, leaf spring actions.

Later, Winchester released a coil spring high wall with a differently shaped butt plate and stock, and an ornate lever with lots of curlicues.  I believe these got the “door knob” style palm rest.  This model was designated the “Laudensack” style.

This is all from my admittedly fading memory, but I think it is correct.  At one time CPA offered semi-inletted butt stocks and white metal butt plate castings in both styles.  Rodney Storie once offered castings of both(?) levers.

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SchwartzStock
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Re: What's a Helm?
Reply #14 - Nov 13th, 2023 at 1:11pm
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"Helm" translates from German to English as "Helmet"....
  

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