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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Help loading my first CPA .32-40 (Read 4561 times)
JLouis
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #15 - Dec 17th, 2022 at 4:18pm
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Might also add that I still have my 20lb. Lee casting pot that I bought some 23 years back and it still works just fine.
  

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Cbashooter
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #16 - Dec 17th, 2022 at 4:49pm
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Waage K-4757 dipper pot is the Cadillac of dipper pots imho.for the money and the available of parts and the warranty the Lee 20# is hard to beat. 

For bottom pour the original RCBS pro melt is the only one to use, I've had mine since 1983.

« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2022 at 5:33pm by Cbashooter »  
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gnoahhh
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #17 - Dec 17th, 2022 at 10:39pm
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Cbashooter wrote on Dec 17th, 2022 at 4:49pm:
Waage K-4757 dipper pot is the Cadillac of dipper pots imho.for the money and the available of parts and the warranty the Lee 20# is hard to beat. 

For bottom pour the original RCBS pro melt is the only one to use, I've had mine since 1983.



Not familiar with Waage. Had to Google it. Pretty impressive. I'll second that about the RCBS ProMelt. One of those, and an antique Lyman 10 pounder, have kept me in the game for about 40 years too. Periodic electric cord replacement has been the sum total of maintenance required.
  
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Mick B
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #18 - Dec 17th, 2022 at 11:31pm
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When the heating element in my Lee packed up, after about 20 years, I thought I would treat myself to something fancy and bought an RCBS Easy Melt. Everything works just fine, but there is one major problem in that you just can't turn if off when you are finished casting, you have to set the temperature control down to about 50 degrees and leave it running till the temperature drops to that level. Depending on the temperature where you are casting this can take up to three hours, then you have to return and turn it off manually. 
In my opinion it would be better if it turned itself off when it reached the set temperature.
Because of this issue I would not buy another one, I had no issues with the Lee, and with hindsight should just have bought a new element and saved about 100 dollars.
Just my 2C worth,
Mike.
  
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Cbashooter
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #19 - Dec 18th, 2022 at 3:55am
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Mick B-

I also bought one(<not so> easy melt) and sold it quickly for the reasons you stated. 
just a silly system IMHO.
  
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nuclearcricket
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #20 - Dec 18th, 2022 at 9:50am
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For the price its very hard to beat the Lee pots. A few years back I got a lee 20# pot and then built a PID to attach to it. You can either build your own or purchase one all ready built. I see them up for sale on occasion over on the Cast Boolits web site.  It is just so nice to be able to adjust the temp of your melt in small finite steps.  Its a bit surprising just how much difference a few degrees in temp chance can make.  When I built mine I set it up so that I can unplug everything, the pot, the power cord and the thermocouple will all unplug. My thoughts were that if need be I could pick up another thermocouple and just plug into a different pot. 
Hand dipping is probably about the best way to go when casting. Definitely a lot less mess as bottom pour pots tend to drip and make a mess. 
Sam
  
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Lead Pot
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #21 - Dec 18th, 2022 at 11:34am
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I have used just about everything that will melt lead from the kitchen gas stove to a plumbers lead furnace that sounds like a jet engine on take off. The wage is a very good unit but when it burns out they say that they dont have parts for repair. I also have a Lee 20 pounder I use for a back up or it has pure lead for round balls.
When the second Wage went under I got the RCBS easy melt and it holds the temp very well but when you change the alloy with new ingots you might just as well turn the TV on and watch your favorite western and it might have the ingots melted. Maybe, Cheesy and like mentioned it takes forever to turn off when your done with it.
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #22 - Dec 18th, 2022 at 1:08pm
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Dipping from the pot results in better quality bullets.
Unfortunately bottom pour does not produce as good a quality of bullets (from older Schuetzen shooters who have done years of testing).

Do not purchase commercial bullets which are too hard.
Cast your own bullets of 25:1 or 20:1 lead:tin alloy.

Plug seaters work but do not align the bullet as concentrically in the bore.
I found this made a difference of up to 6 points lost on a target.
Best to find a breech seater that will insert the bullet concentrically into the bore and allow you to adjust the depth so you can maximize the accuracy of your rifle.
Fixed ammunition is not competitive in this game.
Adjust your seater so the base of the bullet is at least halfways engraved by the rifling.
This is essential to obtain a great seal of the bullet base which prevents gas cutting around the bullet.

You need a bullet at least as wide as your groove-to-groove diameter of your barrel.
To obtain great gas seal I always use bullets that are actually .002" wider than my groove-to-groove diameter.

John Louis is suggesting the powders MP300 AA#9 and H108 (recycled military WC820 powder).
They are a very good recommendation and will provide much better performance.
AA4100 is a slightly better quality AA #9 style powder.
Generally loads of 11.0 to 13.0 grains for these powders.

16:1 twist 175 to 190 grain bullet
14:1 twist 195 to 215 grain bullet
12:1 twist 220 to 230 grain bullet
11.5:1 twist 235 to 240 grain bullet

Powder loads providing 1400 to 1550 fps will provide good accuracy however I have found the speedier bullets tend to be a bit more accurate.

Always place a wad at the cartridge nose to hold the powder in.
Placing a wad down on the powder can result in ringing your barrel from a double compression wave that can form.

A partially filled case works well as long as the powder lies level in the bottom of the case - which occurs since we fire in a level position.

I prefer the Remington primers since they have a longer and hotter flash.

Do not size your fired cases. 
Fired cases seal better in the chamber and do not need to be modified after firing since you are not making fixed ammo.

Refining your load accuracy, developing your shooting skills of judging wind and mirage plus refining your bench technique - there is the potential to achieve 1/2 MOA accuracy from .32 caliber rifles.


Picture of targets from adjusting depth bullet is seated (1/4 turn on Weber seater).
« Last Edit: Dec 18th, 2022 at 1:28pm by Schuetzendave »  
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RSW
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #23 - Dec 19th, 2022 at 10:47am
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Dave
Bravo!
That's the BEST summation of loading for the Schuetzen game I have ever read. You definitely stated the essence about as concisely as it can be put into words.
EVERYONE on this forum should copy your post and keep it with their loading data (I have already done that).
« Last Edit: Dec 19th, 2022 at 11:07am by RSW »  

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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #24 - Dec 19th, 2022 at 2:16pm
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The only thing I'd add to this discussion is that you might want to buy a copy Randy's book "Loading and Shooting Traditional Schuetzen Rifles."
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #25 - Dec 19th, 2022 at 5:47pm
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RSW's book is an excellent resource regarding the use of single shot rifles with plain base cast bullets.
I wish it was available when I started the Schuetzen game. 

Instead I had to pick the brains of Old Schuetzen shooters and then try to determine what was meaningful information.
Unfortunately there are some in this World with a strange attitude who enjoy stringing people along or those who spread misinformation and old wives tales without proper scientific testing of the procedure.
  
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Green_Frog
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #26 - Dec 23rd, 2022 at 4:47pm
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Well, I’m sort of trying to return to ASSRA competition after several years of health and family issues.  I’m working from memory here (admittedly sketchy) but Dave, I have to ask how a mechanical breech seater can be more accurate seating a bullet than a plugged case.  Both carry the bullet to the chamber in the same specially prepared case.  The bullet is then pushed forward into the lands and grooves by a rod, moved by either a lever and cam type arrangement or the forward motion of the rifle’s own breechblock.  Not trying to be argumentative but genuinely curious… the push rod is captive in the case, so how can it seat the bullet any differently regardless of how it is pushed?  Huh  If I were starting fresh now with a CPA I’d be using a plugged case until I saw more need to buy an additional tool.   

Just to throw a little more mud in the water, a simple push seater is sort of a combination of both methods and may predate both.  This method works well for lots of folks, especially with a well fit bullet.  Wink

On the subject of bought vs self cast bullets, in my active years shooting, I routinely cast my own except when shooting “store bought” bullets for a product review.  Of course I was always looking for that “magic bullet” that only shot centers, but I kept returning to a 200 gr Barnett bullet I got years ago from Keith Foster because it was too big for his needs and a venerable original 185 gr Ideal mould (319289) for bench and offhand respectively.  I just couldn’t find anything I could shoot better.  Just for the record, I’ve found I can get really nice bullets out of a Lee or RCBS bottom pour if I cast hot and fast.    
Cool

To respond to the OP, I would suggest you look for a mentor to take you in tow and help you find one really good bullet and concentrate on maxing out your skills and the rifle’s potential.  With the discontinuation of my two favorites,IMR 4759 for offhand and H-108 for bench, I would look at IMR 4227 to replace the former and Accurate #7 or #9 for the latter.  Fortunately I have a lifetime supply of my two favorites stashed.  Smiley

All for now.  Welcome to the madness!
Froggie
  
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #27 - Dec 23rd, 2022 at 5:30pm
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Froggie, I think Dave is referring to the kind of plugged case seater that CPA sells.  Just a short piece of brass rod glued into a cartridge case, so not adjustable and nothing to support the sides of the bullet or aim it straight.  I use them on one CPA because I have no Weber seater for that one.  It works well if the bullet doesn't need much force to seat, but I am nowhere near as good as Dave at this game.

Chris.
  
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #28 - Dec 23rd, 2022 at 11:12pm
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Thanks, gunlaker. When I think plugged case, I think of one with the head drilled out to the same diameter as the bullet and a rod (usually brass, but sometimes aluminum, steel, or even wood) cut a few thousandths longer than the case.  The rod is pulled back just far enough to hold a little of the bullet as it’s inserted into the chamber, then the closing of the block pushes the rod the rest of the way in to seat the bullet. 

Sounds more complicated than it actually is, but I still prefer using a mechanical seater like the ones I have from Willis (“singleshot”) Gregory.  Wish he was still making them!

Froggie
  
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Re: Help loading my first CPA .32-40
Reply #29 - Dec 24th, 2022 at 9:50am
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I've made similar ones for one of my 38-55 highwalls, but instead of using the action to push the plunger rod, I use a Klein nut driver 😊

I recently bought a seater that bpjack made for my .32-40 highwall.  I like it a lot.

Chris.
  
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