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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE (Read 4689 times)
JLouis
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #15 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 11:37am
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Which of the ACGG Guild members would now choose to use Poly instead of an oil finish when restoring a collectable firearm back to its original condition.
  

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MrTipUp
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #16 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 12:10pm
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Whatever you think of them as durable, protective finishes, multi-coat oil finishes do not work well in high-production environments.  Therefore, most if not all US-factory-produced "collectible firearms" originally had their wood parts finished in varnishes or shellacs of one type or another.

Bill Lawrence
  
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marlinguy
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #17 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 12:37pm
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JLouis wrote on Jun 6th, 2021 at 11:37am:
Which of the ACGG Guild members would now choose to use Poly instead of an oil finish when restoring a collectable firearm back to its original condition.


As I mentioned previously. Steve Durren posted a lengthy how to on a beautiful Rolling Block he posted to the ASSRA Journal some years back, using Laurel Mountain Permalyn Sealer....a poly finish.
  

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burntwater
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #18 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 1:07pm
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MrTipUp wrote on Jun 6th, 2021 at 12:10pm:
Whatever you think of them as durable, protective finishes, multi-coat oil finishes do not work well in high-production environments.  Therefore, most if not all US-factory-produced "collectible firearms" originally had their wood parts finished in varnishes or shellacs of one type or another.

Bill Lawrence


Actually most of the better gun makers used a proprietary varnish-oil mix with tinting. This mix was heated and parts were dipped in large radiator heated vats. This approach resulted in max penetration of wood and thick even coverage. I learned this from a older millwright who worked for Larrabee & Hingston in Peabody, MA ( oldest maker of large wooden water tanks ) but set up finish lines for Winchester, Marlin and other gun makers in the Connecticut Valley. 
  
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marlinguy
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #19 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 1:20pm
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Most of the early gun makers dipped their stocks in varnish or shellac for the first step, regardless of what subsequent later steps were used.
The dipping simply sped up the processes later. So even their hand rubbed high end "piano" finishes started out with a dip to seal the wood first.
  

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JLouis
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #20 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 2:02pm
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I am sure I have that same Journal in my stack. Do you happen to know which issue it is, I would like to go back and re-read it if you happen to know.
  

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burntwater
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Re: How to finish CPA sanded stock? UPDATE
Reply #21 - Jun 6th, 2021 at 7:46pm
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Hand rubbing in a oil finish doesn’t have to be nearly as involved as some people may think. I worked with a very famous furniture finisher and touch up artist in So Florida in the late 60’s. More or less an apprentice learning all the time from cigarette burns on Steinways to drink rings on tables and end pieces, hand rubbed French polishing, lacquers, you name it.  If stock makers are telling you they’re using rottenstone it’s probably to break a high gloss varnish or urethane to create depth and a rubbed oil appearance. Some finishes like lacquer can be polished with pumice and rottenstone to high gloss while other finishes like varnishes dull from abrasives that break the surface. But rottenstone on oil is wrong. 

Min-Wax is like most paint and coating companies these days. Marketing products that don’t require much hand work, look like the real thing ( more or less ) and require little skill or proficiency to apply. But polyurethane is polyurethane and that is, it’s a polymer plastic coating. Just read the MSDS sheet and compare,  it’s all there.  They add some special vehicle to thin for rubbing, more drier and perhaps some colorant to act like a drying oil but it’s not — it’s plastic. And not only that polyurethane isn’t even a great moisture barrier like Tung oil. Those who swear by it will swear at it when the end grain exposed around action and tang inletting starts to darken from gun solvents and moisture. The smart move is to treat all exposed end grain with a sealer or barrier coat immune to gun cleaners/solvents. Polyurethane is ‘ hygroscopic ‘ meaning it lets moisture pass through. This has been proven during tests at the US Forest Labs.

“ Hygroscopic polymers include nylon, ABS, acrylic, PET, PBT, polyurethane, polycarbonate, and others. Each of these materials absorb moisture internally and release moisture through the air. ... Non-hygroscopic polymers include PVC, polypropylene, polystyrene, polyethylene and others. “

Convenience and ease of application are polyurethanes strong points plus a very tough durable hide. When a good gunsmith elects to use a polyurethane finish I can’t honestly believe he/she does so because it’s a superior method or product. But instead it’s a production choice the type any small or large shop has to make every day. Let’s remember that these polyurethane coatings havent been around that long compared to the tried and true oil systems that date back to Grecian times. Already kitchen cabinet makers are
  
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