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Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions (Read 10745 times)

oj Newbie Offline Posts: 1 Joined: Nov 7^th, 2018	Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Nov 11^th, 2018 at 12:29pm	Print Post
	What are the dimensions on a Sharps 40-50 straight cartridge?


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #1 - Nov 11^th, 2018 at 3:50pm	Print Post
	.554" rim .454" base 1.88" case length @.421 neck diameter I make mine using .303 British brass shortened, and opened up to .40 caliber.

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Deadeye Bly Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1145 Location: Stephens City Joined: Feb 25^th, 2011	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #2 - Nov 12^th, 2018 at 8:47pm	Print Post
	The original cartridge shot bore diameter paper patch bullets and the neck diameter reflects that. If you plan a new rifle shooting modern .408" diameter grease groove bullets then you will need a neck diameter of .434"-.435" diameter. The 303 brass neck thickness is .012-.014". Krag brass runs a little thinner but it has been scarce for the past several years.


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #3 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 10:15am	Print Post
	Deadeye Bly wrote on Nov 12^th, 2018 at 8:47pm: The original cartridge shot bore diameter paper patch bullets and the neck diameter reflects that. If you plan a new rifle shooting modern .408" diameter grease groove bullets then you will need a neck diameter of .434"-.435" diameter. The 303 brass neck thickness is .012-.014". Krag brass runs a little thinner but it has been scarce for the past several years. Neck thickness doesn't really come into play for either .303 or .30-40 since you cut them off at the shoulder to use for .40-50SS. They're much longer than the .40-50SS.

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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7659 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #4 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 12:45pm	Print Post
	I think what DB is getting at, is that a outside neck diameter of .421 will be to small for .408 - .410 GG bullets if, you want to shoot them fixed. If shooting fixed GG bullets is the goal, the neck in the chamber needs to be, your chosen bullet diameter, plus 2x the neck thickness you choose, plus .001 - .002 for chamber clearance. A good neck thickness is .010 and if the 303 necks are .012 - .014, you'll have to turn the necks to that or make your cases first and then add the neck thickness you get from them. .015 is ok for neck thickness, many cartridges such as the 30-06 use that thickness. But, for fixed accuracy, after working the brass that much, you would want to turn the necks to a even thickness. Frank

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Jeff_Schultz ASSRA Board Member Offline Posts: 1660 Location: Ransomville, NY Joined: Apr 25^th, 2004	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #5 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 5:38pm	Print Post
	I measured a well used case used for breachseating. The OD at the mouth about .432, wall thickness about .012. A .410 bullet would not quite enter the case. The chamber was cut with a modern reamer (I think Clymer).

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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #6 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 6:10pm	Print Post
	The measurement of .421" is not an exact measurement of cases, or chambers. It is what the cartridge is specified as, and I doubt it is exactly true to guns or cases. I shoot .411" grease groove bullets in my shortened .303 British cases and I don't thin the necks at all. Just shorten, expand, and chamfer the mouths. They drop right in my chambers on both guns, even before the final fire forming.

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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7659 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #7 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 6:44pm	Print Post
	Vall, Is yours a original chamber and what is the diameter of the neck, after firing the case? If the OP is posting to get dimensions for a reamer or why a cartridge won't fit, he needs to take into account the bullet brass and neck size. If he is just wanting to identify a cartridge case, then the .421 may be useful. Frank

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Deadeye Bly Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1145 Location: Stephens City Joined: Feb 25^th, 2011	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #8 - Nov 13^th, 2018 at 9:02pm	Print Post
	The .421" dimension is what is listed in Cartridges of the World. I measured the necks of shortened and fireformed cases from 303 and Krag brass. I'm a fan of the 40-50 SS cartridge and have been promoting it since I wrote an article in the Black Powder Cartridge News in 2009. It is everything many people wish the 38/55 to be. Not to run down the 38/55 as I have several of those also.


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #9 - Nov 14^th, 2018 at 11:19am	Print Post
	Frank, My barrel is indeed an original 30" half octagon marked .40 S and my brass measures .434" before and after firing.

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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #10 - Nov 14^th, 2018 at 11:25am	Print Post
	Deadeye Bly wrote on Nov 13^th, 2018 at 9:02pm: The .421" dimension is what is listed in Cartridges of the World. I measured the necks of shortened and fireformed cases from 303 and Krag brass. I'm a fan of the 40-50 SS cartridge and have been promoting it since I wrote an article in the Black Powder Cartridge News in 2009. It is everything many people wish the 38/55 to be. Not to run down the 38/55 as I have several of those also. I also appreciate the .38-55 and have many rifles chambered in it. But I think the .40-50SS is an improvement on the .38-55 that will do everything the .38-55 does, but a little better as you start to stretch it's legs! As I mentioned previously I didn't own a .40-50SS until about 18 months ago. I found mine at the Denver show last year, and was more interested in it being a #1 Rolling Block Sporter in nice condition. When I saw the caliber marking I thought it might be fun to have a new .40 that was different, and figured the small case capacity could be fun with mild smokeless loads. It's proven to be so much fun that I was building a pistol gripped deluxe #1 Roller with a .40 caliber barrel, and changed the chamber to also be another .40-50SS. It was planned to be a .40-65, but the .40-50 won out.

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Deadeye Bly Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1145 Location: Stephens City Joined: Feb 25^th, 2011	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #11 - Nov 14^th, 2018 at 4:55pm	Print Post
	As I said I'm a big fan of the 40-50 SS. I have one on order from Shiloh and another in the works on a high wall action. As I've gotten older I realize I don't need those big thumpers to knock over steel targets. My son shot a 40-50 for about 5 years and in that time he only rang one ram with it in KY. I rang a ram with a 45/70 in KY. Sometime you just get a contrary animal that refuses to fall over.


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18055 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #12 - Nov 15^th, 2018 at 12:00pm	Print Post
	I have more .40 caliber rifles than any other single caliber in old single shots. Largest is my .40-85/90 Ballard. I love that cartridge also, but it's a huge case and a lot of space to fill. My favorite .40 was the .40-63 Ballard, and it's still one I shoot a lot. But discovering the .40-50SS has made me appreciate that stubby little cartridge, and it's small capacity. It's a very efficient little cartridge.

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OLD TUCK Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 469 Location: Middleborough MA Joined: Oct 5^th, 2017	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #13 - Nov 17^th, 2018 at 5:38pm	Print Post
	Sorry I have dragged my feet to respond here. I have original samples of WRA Co. unfired 40-50 SS ammo. here are dimensions from the best two samples I have. Rim Diameter .553/.5535 Rim Thickness .0665/.0675 Base Diameter in front of Rim .451 Case diameter at front with bullet in. .419/.420 Paper Patch Bullet in case Diameter .400/401 over patch. Overall case length. 1.884 (2) Paper Patch bullet with Patch removed. .397. and is hollow based. Base has Swaged pocked with Radii. These two cases were the best condition I have among a bunch that have been fired and reloaded. I have also acquired a quantity of shells made from 30-40 Krag and also .303 British? They seem to fit my rifle a Borchardt Short Range model. First efforts shooting did nothing great at 100yds. But have plans to do more. Bore and rifling looks very good but is dark not shiny bright. Plan to Lap it lightly and see what it does. HTH Regards, FITZ. OLD TUCK


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OLD TUCK Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 469 Location: Middleborough MA Joined: Oct 5^th, 2017	Re: Sharps 40-50 straight dimensions Reply #14 - Nov 17^th, 2018 at 5:46pm	Print Post
	Vall, I have a Military Borchardt with a 40-90 Ballard caliber Barrel that is about 1 1/2 " in diameter. It is faintly stamped A O Zishang ahead of the receiver. Has not been finished as to extractor cut but has a bright shiny beautiful bore. I have plans to finish it up to some level and shoot it as a Bench gun. What do you think of that? FITZ. OLD TUCK


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