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Geezer
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25-20 SS loads
May 31st, 2018 at 2:17pm
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Need some starting direction for 25-20 SS loads using 115gr bullets. I have a bunch of Montana Bullet Co. plain base, smokeless lube (red), 15 BHN, FN bullets. Twish is 1-10 and the rifle is a Ballard offhand. Want to shoot it with smokeless until I get set up with breech seater. Load books and online data sources are all over the place, but helpful. I have 4227, RL7, 4198, H110, 2400. Tried Unique; blew primers: too hot. These bullets appear to be cast quite well, though they could be a tich better. I just need to practice and experiment. I also have BACO 85 grain FNs that are perfectly (or as near to that as possible) cast and lubed with SPG. Perhaps I should melt the red lube off and replace with SPG?
Thanks troops,
Geezer
  
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Geezer
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #1 - May 31st, 2018 at 2:18pm
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Not twish, twist!
  
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frnkeore
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #2 - May 31st, 2018 at 2:33pm
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The 25/20SS and the 25/20 WCF have almost exactly the same case capacity.

For fixed, you can use 25/20WCF starting loads, reduced by 10% and work up.

Even though the 25/20SS has slightly more case capacity than the WCF, the seating depth may be deeper in the SS than the WCF. That is the reason to use starting loads.

Frank
  

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oneatatime
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #3 - May 31st, 2018 at 3:10pm
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Considering that your bullets are 30 to 40% heavier than what the 25-20 SS was designed for (even though your fast twist will handle the weight) I would think serious load reduction to start with would be prudent. What rifle are you using it in?
  
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frnkeore
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #4 - May 31st, 2018 at 3:26pm
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As there is not any published, fixed 115 gr loading data available, anywhere that I know of. I was referring to his 85 gr cast bullets, shot fixed.

I would never recommend using heavier bullets with lighter bullet loading data.

I hope he understood that, if not, I'm sorry for any misunderstanding.

Frank
  

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uscra112
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #5 - May 31st, 2018 at 3:53pm
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This is where having a copy of Quickload is invaluable.

And if Unique blew primers, the charge was too much.  Unique, while not the optimum powder for the .25-20, can work just fine with the right number of grains.   

Of what the OP has in stock, 4227 would be best IMHO, but try 2400 also.  My own choice is AA#9 and more recently AA 4100, in the form of Ramshot Enforcer, (same powder, different label).

Handbook loads for .25-20 WCF are predicated on a SAAMI max pressure that is far, FAR in excess of what should ever be used in a Ballard or Stevens 44.   

That's my nickel's worth.
  

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frnkeore
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #6 - May 31st, 2018 at 4:43pm
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If he can use QL, he will have to make up a dumby cartridge first, so that the seating depth is know and should only use slower powders like Enforcer and 300MP with the 115 bullet.

Frank
  

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waterman
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #7 - May 31st, 2018 at 5:07pm
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uscra112 wrote on May 31st, 2018 at 3:53pm:
This is where having a copy of Quickload is invaluable.

And if Unique blew primers, the charge was too much.  Unique, while not the optimum powder for the .25-20, can work just fine with the right number of grains.  

Of what the OP has in stock, 4227 would be best IMHO, but try 2400 also.  My own choice is AA#9 and more recently AA 4100, in the form of Ramshot Enforcer, (same powder, different label).

Handbook loads for .25-20 WCF are predicated on a SAAMI max pressure that is far, FAR in excess of what should ever be used in a Ballard or Stevens 44.   

That's my nickel's worth.   


+1 on this.  The OP will be better off putting the 115 grain bullets on the shelf and getting some plain base 85 to 87 grain bullets.  I have also blown primers in the 25-20 SS when using Unique.
  
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Shortgrub
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #8 - Jun 16th, 2018 at 1:03pm
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Howdy all. I know this is an older post but I just acquired a Stevens 44 in 25-20 SS. Got all the goodies to reload and some good starting loads. My question is using smokeless powder do you use something to hold the powder in place when breach seating? What about Black powder loads? I have Goex and Swiss 1.5

Thanks
  
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #9 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 10:10pm
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I'm not sure how germane this is to the discussion at this time, but the only two low wall actions I have ever seen that seem to have been stretched while using factory loads were... 25-20 SS.  This is only anecdotal info, but I feel I would be remiss to not mention it.  BTW, I am in the process of building a custom 25-20 SS low wall, but I WILL be very circumspect with my loads.

Froggie
  
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Geezer
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #10 - Jul 17th, 2018 at 8:22am
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Hello gents,
This reply is tardy: apologies. I'm simply thanking you all for your replies. Your advice about starting very conservatively is very sound, and appreciated. The rifle I wanted to use the 115 gr bullets in is a Ballard No. 6 with a 1-10 twist. I'm going back to 85 and 90 grainers in this rifle, but I also have a Stevens 44 (1-15 twist) that I've been experimenting with. The rifle has had some very good receiver work and is tight as a drum. Briefly, I've started with reduced loads, 7.5 gr 4227, Federal small rifle primers. There's unburned powder in the bore, but it shoots beautifully with this load. I'm wondering if the lighter load is the cause of the unburned powder and if using small pistol primers might help to effectively burn the full charge. My groups are great at 50 yards and very good at 100. I can live with some unburned powder, but realize that if it works back into the chamber, problems will result.
I feel I'm on the right track now and will continue on it with the Ballard -- just with a bit lighter bullets. Thank you again.

Ramblings of an aging newbie? yes.

  
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #11 - Jul 18th, 2018 at 11:18am
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FYI, if you monitor e-bay molds for a short while you may find a Winchester mold or an Ideal tool for 25-20SS (or WCF) and the molds are apparently the same as Ideal #25720-86 whether marked 25-20R (WCF) all are apparently the same.  These tools are plentiful and it is a buyers market.  With luck, an Ideal 25-20SS #4 tool with sizing device can be had reasonably cheap.  8.0 gr MP5744 with this half hard bullet works for me in my Hopkins & Allen 3925.  Haven't tried it in my Stevens 44 or my tip-up yet.  So many guns, so little time.

James
  
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Re: 25-20 SS loads
Reply #12 - May 7th, 2023 at 8:29pm
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This is an old Winchester mold I'm tuning-up that casts an 86 grain 25720 bullet
  
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