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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Sharps 45 2 4/10 (Read 16243 times)
29aholic
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Sharps 45 2 4/10
Mar 11th, 2016 at 11:52am
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Hi guys,
I have a C. Sharps Big Timber Long Range Express in 45 2 4/10
The bullet I want to use is a 535gr semi-Postell.
I need a good BP load for it. I have tried 80gr weighed and it is a chore to seat the bullet enough to chamber. Any suggestions would be great.
Thanks
Curtis
  

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oneatatime
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #1 - Mar 11th, 2016 at 12:15pm
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Curtis, a good BP load is one your rifle likes. You could start by dropping the bullet in the chamber and measuring the distance from the end of the barrel to the base of the bullet. Transfer that distance to the case and see where the base of the bullet ends up. Everything below this is the space available for wad and powder. The two basic ways to get the powder in the case are by just dumping it in or using a drop tube of a couple of feet length. The drop tube will yield more powder in the same space. This plus the wad is your base charge with no compression. Some powders, like Swiss, are fine with no compression. Some, like Goex seem to like compression up to maybe even 1/4 inch. To add more powder you must use compression but not with the bullet - it will be deformed. Use a compression die. Do not crimp the bullet. Try large pistol primers. Somewhere in all this you will find what the rifle likes. Its more like alchemy than science.
  
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Mick B
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #2 - Mar 11th, 2016 at 6:24pm
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I agree with all of the above, however if for whatever reason you wish to increase your powder charge above 80 gr then changing to a bullet that has reduced front driving bands, such as a BACO Money Bullet may help to achieve that aim as it can be seated out further thereby increasing case capacity.
If you have a chronograph you might be surprised as to how little extra velocity you get, even with an extra five grains of powder. It becomes a case of diminishing returns.
In my opinion once you have a load that will shoot consistent 1.5" groups at 100 meters with black powder, on a nice day, then you should spend more time on your shooting technique than load experimentation.  Failing to follow this advice will result in you collecting a huge mould collection, various grades and makes of powder, plus a collection of different primers by different manufacturers, don't ask how I know all this.
Mike.
  
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #3 - Mar 11th, 2016 at 6:39pm
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What Mike says is true Smiley

When you say it's a chore to seat bullets with 80gr of powder, what exactly do you mean?  With a compression die you can control seating depth very easily.  If you don't have one, it's an excellent thing to buy.

BTW, Is your rifle a C. Sharps, or a Shiloh?  The Long Range Express is a Shiloh model.

Chris.
  
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29aholic
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #4 - Mar 15th, 2016 at 4:19pm
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gunlaker wrote on Mar 11th, 2016 at 6:39pm:
What Mike says is true Smiley

When you say it's a chore to seat bullets with 80gr of powder, what exactly do you mean?  With a compression die you can control seating depth very easily.  If you don't have one, it's an excellent thing to buy.

BTW, Is your rifle a C. Sharps, or a Shiloh?  The Long Range Express is a Shiloh model.

Chris.


Chris,
My gun is a C. Sharps. It is about 20 years old IIRC. I could swear it said Long Range Express on it, but I could be wrong. The only one on their website that looks like mine now is the 1874 Heavy Hartford, but my receiver is casehardened and not engraved.
  

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29aholic
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #5 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 11:12am
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Everything I have shot through my gun so far has been phenomenal. I had some 5744 loads with 405's that shot one ragged hole with the sights. I would just prefer to stick with BP since that was what were originally for.
  

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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #6 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 3:34pm
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No need talking about loads then. Let's talk about your Sharps. Let's start with pictures. I want to see it. 

Here is Biggi shooting my Sharps when it was a 40-65W and had the RH tang sight mounted. Sports a MVA 101 now. 

        Joe.
  

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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #7 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 6:23pm
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29aholic, it sounds like you have never loaded bp in cartridges before, and if I am wrong I apologize right up front. One thing you should have is a compression die to compress the powder. Next is you need to determine how much powder it takes to fill your case to the bottom of the bullet. Do this by loading a dummy round to where you want the bullet to be and then measure the OAL of the round and subtract the length of the case and the length of the bullet, the resulting number is how deep your powder charge should be from the case mouth. That is how far you want your powder compression plug to enter your case. 
Start your load development by filling your case with powder to that depth, seat a wad and your bullet. Then work up your load by 2 grain increments, nothing else changes just the amount of powder you are using. Your rifle will tell you when  you hit the magic volume.
I hope this helps you out some. 
Sam
  
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #8 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 7:35pm
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What reloading tools do you have? Yes a compression die is handy. I've never seen or used one. Do my compressing with the third die, the neck expander die.

BP is a lot of fun and of course you will either get BP accuracy or phenomenal accuracy. 

Waiting for pictures, fingers tapping on the table here, toes tapping. 


           Joe.
  

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John Boy
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #9 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 7:45pm
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Curtis: A good reading primer: Introduction to BPCR Reloading
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westerner
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #10 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 7:53pm
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Excellent JB. But maybe we should wait till he posts pictures of his outfit. 
Almost like a little blackmail............

        Joe.
  

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John Boy
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #11 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 8:19pm
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Joe, when Curtis posts his rifle pictures - got another good link written by Dick Trenk   Wink
  
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #12 - Mar 16th, 2016 at 10:37pm
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My bullet. 

The first group.  Shoots a lot better now.   


      Joe.
  

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29aholic
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #13 - Mar 17th, 2016 at 12:32pm
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Sorry guys, here is the requested pic. I looked at it last night and it just says Old Reliable on it, but I believe it is an early Heavy Hartford. That's my daughter in the pic. She swearing at me under her breath "Take the f**king picture already, this b***h is heavy!"
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Re: Sharps 45 2 4/10
Reply #14 - Mar 17th, 2016 at 3:07pm
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As you stated in your initial post, that would be a C. Sharps rather than a Shiloh.

Where are you located and we can recommend some local shoots for you attend. Always fun to do so and your rifle should be very competitive out to 1000yd, though you might find it a wee bit 'tiresome' from the bench at Schuetzen distances.  Wink.
  

Glenn - Stevens 044 1/2, Bartlein SS 5R barrel in 22LR
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