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Can someone explain to me ....... (Read 10760 times)

cuslog Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 263 Location: Calgary, Alberta Joined: Dec 29^th, 2011	Can someone explain to me ....... Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 1:05pm	Print Post
	The purpose of the holes I see in the muzzle end of some rifle barrels -- 4 or 5 holes in a circle around the flat of the muzzle. I'm an ex-bullseye pistol shooter but new to the Scheutzen or BPCR world. I'd never seen that before. Thanks


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nuclearcricket Oldtimer Offline Posts: 740 Joined: Oct 15^th, 2008	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #1 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 1:12pm	Print Post
	Those holes are for a false muzzle. When the barrel was made a portion of it was cut off and the pin holes were drilled in both parts and then the barrel was contoured. The purpose of the false muzzle was to allow the rifle to have the bullet leaded from the front and seated on a charged case.The theory being that the bullet is all ready engraved with the rifling and the bullet aligned in the bore, thus increasing accuracy. This is my understanding of things, hopefully if anything I said is wrong others will correct me. Sam


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 15994 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #2 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 1:19pm	Print Post
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uscra112 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4079 Location: Switzerland of Ohio Joined: May 7^th, 2007	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #3 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 1:25pm	Print Post
	The false muzzle piece was cut off, drilled and fitted with pins, then reassembled for final reaming and rifling. This so that when the false muzzle was in place, the bore and rifling would line up perfectly, to ease the insertion of the bullet from the muzzle. As nuclearcricket said, the idea was to have the bullet perfectly central to the bore and perfectly straight when the powder was lit off. In blackpowder days another claimed benefit was that any remaining fouling from the previous shot was scraped down and out the chamber end.

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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11421 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #4 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 1:56pm	Print Post
	The smallest group one of my rifles ever shot was when the bullets were muzzle loaded by me and shot by a buddy. Was using smokeless powder and a Pope style bullet. I was loading and spotting. Just kept telling him good shot, do it again. Was a ten shot dime size group at 100 yards. His jaw dropped when he saw the target. Iron sights. Think he wore the target out showing it to anyone who'd look. Single shots can be a lot of fun. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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calledflyer Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3536 Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #5 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 2:28pm	Print Post
	If I buy a rifle with a false muzzle will you load for me?


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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11421 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #6 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 3:14pm	Print Post
	Looking forward to it! Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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cuslog Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 263 Location: Calgary, Alberta Joined: Dec 29^th, 2011	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #7 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 4:04pm	Print Post
	So,,, Kind of like breach seating in reverse ? Hmm -- don't know how comfortable I'd feel ramming a bullet down a bore -- onto a charged case. I guess the muzzle loader guys do it all the time though.


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calledflyer Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3536 Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #8 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 4:49pm	Print Post
	Not that I ever did it, but the bullet goes into the bore with an empty chamber- action open to let any fouling fall free. When the bullet is entered into a predetermined place, then the loaded case is inserted and the action closed. Proceed to shoot and repeat.


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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7242 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #9 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 8:17pm	Print Post
	Muzzle loaders do it w/o a cap installed. Frank

	ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11421 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #10 - Feb 2^nd, 2016 at 8:35pm	Print Post
	I always use a plugged case. Push the bullet down onto the plug. Old fouling makes a good gas seal. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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Kurt_701 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1010 Location: Missouri Joined: May 20^th, 2004	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #11 - Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 7:51pm	Print Post
	I believe Pope said the main benefit of seating with a false muzzle was the lead displaced by the rifling was pushed toward the bullet nose rather than forming fins on the base. That lent toward better accuracy. Kurt

	M-14 3rd Battalion 27th Marines RVN 68'69'
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Schuetzenmiester Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 6707 Location: Cool Wet Side of WA Joined: Apr 27^th, 2008	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #12 - Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 8:40pm	Print Post
	Kurt_701 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 7:51pm: I believe Pope said the main benefit of seating with a false muzzle was the lead displaced by the rifling was pushed toward the bullet nose rather than forming fins on the base. That lent toward better accuracy. Kurt Good theory, but mine never shot any better ML. IMO, disturbing the set up on the bench would be more detrimental than the fins made by the rifling.

	"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #13 - Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 9:22pm	Print Post
	Schuetzenmiester wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 8:40pm: Kurt_701 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 7:51pm: I believe Pope said the main benefit of seating with a false muzzle was the lead displaced by the rifling was pushed toward the bullet nose rather than forming fins on the base. That lent toward better accuracy. Kurt Good theory, but mine never shot any better ML. IMO, disturbing the set up on the bench would be more detrimental than the fins made by the rifling. Did you try it off-hand?

	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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uscra112 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4079 Location: Switzerland of Ohio Joined: May 7^th, 2007	Re: Can someone explain to me ....... Reply #14 - Feb 3^rd, 2016 at 9:45pm	Print Post
	Toward the end of the era, an awful lot of top shooters were breech seating, not loading from the muzzle.

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