Welcome, Guest. Please
Login
or
Register
ASSRA Home
Board Index
Help
Search
Login
Register
ASSRA Forum
›
General
›
General Discussion
› Muzzle rests
(Moderator Group: Moderator)
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
Pages:
1
2
[3]
4
5
Send Topic
Print
Muzzle rests (Read 29024 times)
RSW
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 1295
Location: Arizona
Joined: Sep 8
th
, 2006
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #30 -
Mar 24
th
, 2015 at 9:03pm
Print Post
ledball
The 6" wide limit was derived at through no small amount of discussion and consideration of alternatives, including no limits. The size limits got started as a result of a shooter wanting to use a muzzle rest that weighed about 20 pounds. The board of directors decided limits were in order.
You have a point about why not 6 1/2" but then why not 6 1/2 feet?
Randy W
ASSRA 10211 - ISSA 125
There are indeed two Americas. Simply put, it is not the haves and have nots. The two Americans are in reality divided into those who do and those who don't.
GTalk
IP Logged
beltfed
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 1822
Location: Central Wi
Joined: Dec 20
th
, 2007
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #31 -
Mar 24
th
, 2015 at 9:30pm
Print Post
Can I presume that the sled/muzzle rest is attached
at the null point of the barrel?
Or to put it another way, it seems to me the attachment
of the muzzle rest may affect the harmonics of the
barrel- favorably or unfavorably depending on where it is clamped on.
beltfed/arnie
IP Logged
Oldman1950
Senior Forum Member
Offline
Posts: 266
Location: Virginia
Joined: Feb 8
th
, 2014
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #32 -
Mar 25
th
, 2015 at 10:34am
Print Post
Here is the muzzle rest that I made for my CPA 44 1/2. It works well to control the front end of the rifle. Some of us old farts can no longer do offhand for health reasons. It is just under 6" wide and is about 3/4 of a pound in weight. Having shot Heavy muzzle loading bench guns for many years I have seen just about everything attached to the muzzle of guns for a rest. If someone wants to strap an old sink on their rifle it is OK with me. If it is what they want to use I see no harm in it.
IP Logged
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 4144
Location: Benton Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #33 -
Mar 25
th
, 2015 at 11:21am
Print Post
That looks like a pretty typical of the simple solid effective DIY muzzle rests I have seen on the range.
Some are more elaborately machined and/or of different materials. But all are usually more or less that size in terms of height, width, and length and shot off a similar front platform.
It's not really that different from the Pope version and operates on the same principles, a bit larger and bulkier and with round stock for the "feet" rather than the flat base of the Pope device.
The Pope device we consider a muzzle-rest was the muzzle rest portion of a simple machine rest that incorporated an adjustable action support that allowed a positive repeatable return-to-battery. It is mounted on a wood base that has a row of drilled holes extending back for the muzzle end that are tightly sized to hold a locator peg that is engaged by a notch on the front of the muzzle rest. I believe that accurate brass/bronze replicas of the Pope front rest have been produced in the past. I just missed out on picking one up at one of the EG matches last year.
sacred cows make the best burger
IP Logged
Jeff_Schultz
ASSRA Board Member
Offline
Posts: 1657
Location: Ransomville, NY
Joined: Apr 25
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #34 -
Mar 25
th
, 2015 at 12:00pm
Print Post
GeorgeC wrote
on Mar 24
th
, 2015 at 8:53pm:
Jeff_Schultz wrote
on Mar 22
nd
, 2015 at 6:24pm:
If you can make one that violates the ASSRA rules, I'd sure like to see it!
True dat. Some time rules do get confusing. So i would be legal to have the typical Hart rest and a front leather sand bag that I used to use in BR matches or not?
That is perfectly acceptable.
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo
There is no situation so bad that it cannot be made worse."
Confidence- The feeling you get before you fully understand the situation.
IP Logged
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 4144
Location: Benton Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #35 -
Mar 25
th
, 2015 at 1:40pm
Print Post
I just found the earlier discussion that contains the photos of the replica Pope rest.
The photo of the muzzle-rest is with the 1st post on the top of the 2nd page.
(You need to
Login
or
Register
to view media files and links)
num=1410028408/15
Note that allen-head caps crews were not used on it
Re clamping position: my experience to date has been with heavy stiff barrels on 22rf rifles. On them, the position does not seem to be particularly critical. Ammo selection, conditions, and rifle holding technique have more impact on accuracy----and probably mask any variable created by the muzzle rest. once I transition to using it for load devilment for centerfire offhand rifles I may find a different situation.
Edit: I just noticed that ought-to correct substituted "load devilment" for my intended "load development" but since it may well be more accurate than not I'll let the unintended humor stand
«
Last Edit: Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 9:07am by QuestionableMaynard8130
»
sacred cows make the best burger
IP Logged
40_Rod
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Extremism in the persuit
of accuracy is not a
vice
Posts: 4285
Location: Knoxville, TN
Joined: Apr 20
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #36 -
Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 8:54am
Print Post
In light of RWS post the answer seems obvious. If you plan on shooting a variety of events your Bobsled should be no wider than 6” and no higher that 3”. That way you are legal in both organizations.
40 Rod
IP Logged
ledball
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 1021
Location: syracuse, ohio
Joined: Nov 20
th
, 2009
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #37 -
Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 2:11pm
Print Post
Assra can go no farther without adopting a limit on the width of a muzzle rest, I propose the width be no longer than the width of the bench (about 3 feet ) longer than this would probably wipe your buddy's bench off during recoil. How-about a 6 inch muzzle rest with outriggers. Ledball
IP Logged
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 4144
Location: Benton Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #38 -
Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 7:13pm
Print Post
Paul, I'm more concerned about the weight. Those solid oak planks are getting old. By the time you add up the weight of the tool / shooting boxes, lead filled front rests, powder canisters and measures, scope stands and scopes, boxes of bullets, "heavy-sand" (If not lead dust) filled bags plus some rifles that have to be using 30 pounds we must be using their limits. Then there is the not inconsiderable weight of the shooters leaning on the tops.
I'm afraid that if we get into a muzzle rest- "arms race" we are going to get over-sized rests made of depleted uranium, tungsten, or that ultra heavy unobtanium made of condensed dark matter. We are going to have to raise match fees in order to finance replacing the bench tops with 4 inches of steel reinforced concrete.
sacred cows make the best burger
IP Logged
ledball
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 1021
Location: syracuse, ohio
Joined: Nov 20
th
, 2009
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #39 -
Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 9:10pm
Print Post
DW, you've got a handle on this muzzle rest thing, you're seeing bad things coming way down the road. What do you think about the outriggers, I thought it was a great idea. Ledball
IP Logged
westerner
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
deleted posts and threads
record holder.
Posts: 12286
Location: Why, out West of course
Joined: May 29
th
, 2006
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #40 -
Mar 26
th
, 2015 at 10:40pm
Print Post
Outriggers with deer whistles on the ends. Perfect for target shooting at Cody. Well, woulda. History now.
Joe.
A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
IP Logged
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27
th
, 2008
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #41 -
Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 2:55am
Print Post
If sendo's original question is to compete with modern BR stocks with a traditional schuetzen stock, I would suggest making a wide forearm rather than using muzzle rests. I can post a picture of my Ballard if that is the intention. IMO, muzzle rests will always be at a disadvantage against modern style stocks. But, it is more important to shoot flintlock than to win matches
I'm sure that theory applies to schuetzen rifles, flyrods and dry flies too
"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
IP Logged
westerner
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
deleted posts and threads
record holder.
Posts: 12286
Location: Why, out West of course
Joined: May 29
th
, 2006
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #42 -
Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 3:36am
Print Post
It's a lot of fun messing around with muzzle rests and sleds and stuff. Maybe Sendaro makes it work. More power to him. When that fun has been had it's off onto another area of vintage SS fun.
Flintlock?
Joe.
A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
IP Logged
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 4144
Location: Benton Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17
th
, 2004
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #43 -
Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 9:18am
Print Post
Sorry, non-breechloaders are not allowed in ASSRA matches, though I had been seriously tempted to borrow a Ferguson rifle from a buddy and show up with it at a match just to make heads spin
. Building a match grade target Ferguson is on my bucket list of projects.
Personal opinion/speculation: I'm not sure that the outrigger sled-runner style rest won't create problems of their own when it comes to adjusting for conditions. We tend to adjust for conditions by tweaking the front rest.
With long flat runners with a long solid contact surface on a flat bearing surface I think it
could
bind on elevation adjustments.
As part of a semi-machine rest for ammo testing I think it would work well. Under match conditions it
might
be different.
My personal use, at the current time, is for ammo check and sight-in adjustment for offhand shooting only. I simply want the stability they offer to my euro-schuetzens with their typical stock style. Mine is small and light enough I can still pick it up and shoot offhand with it attached to the barrel. It just helps make the rifle a little muzzle heavy--which I like. a larger more massive muzzle rest would have to be removed before I could shoot it offhand. that'd be a PITA and it might or might not affect the accuracy.
to summarize my opinion. I believe that the muzzle rest adds most value to the offhand shooter who is using a schuetzen style rifle.
Perhaps it may help someone who is shooting a traditional class rifle in the benchrest matches.
I
suspect
it has little of value to add to the shoot who is shooting in a more "unlimited" (in the ASSRA/ISSSA etc context) bench-rest competition.
again JMHO
«
Last Edit: Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 9:27am by QuestionableMaynard8130
»
sacred cows make the best burger
IP Logged
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
Offline
Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27
th
, 2008
Re: Muzzle rests
Reply #44 -
Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 5:33pm
Print Post
QuestionableMaynard8130 wrote
on Mar 27
th
, 2015 at 9:18am:
Personal opinion/speculation: I'm not sure that the outrigger sled-runner style rest won't create problems of their own when it comes to adjusting for conditions. We tend to adjust for conditions by tweaking the front rest.
With long flat runners with a long solid contact surface on a flat bearing surface I think it
could
bind on elevation adjustments.
As part of a semi-machine rest for ammo testing I think it would work well. Under match conditions it
might
be different.
I fiddled around with a couple of them on my Stevens-Pope for a couple years. I found that it takes such a heavy shoulder into the stock, any minor adjustments are quite simple. Move the rear of the rifle. The disturbance of the rear bag is no longer critical as it is with a modern BR style set up.
"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
IP Logged
Pages:
1
2
[3]
4
5
Send Topic
Print
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
Forum Jump »
Board Index
» 10 most recent Posts
» 10 most recent Topics
General
Announcements
General Discussion ««
Single Shot Rifles
Reloading the Single Shot Rifle
Gunsmithing Single Shot Rifles
Collecting Single Shot Rifles
Hunting with Single Shot Rifles
Rifle Photos
ASSRA Match Scores
For Sale/Trade
Support and Feedback
ASSRA.COM Feedback and Suggestions
Forum Help
Membership Support
« Board Index
‹ Board
ASSRA Forum
» Powered by
YaBB 2.6.12
!
YaBB Forum Software
© 2000-2026. All Rights Reserved.
Page completed in 1.4869 seconds.