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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Mould tune up Part @ (Read 9140 times)
boho
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Mould tune up Part @
Mar 14th, 2014 at 5:51pm
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If you have to bang on the mould more than 2 times then your just knocking your self out and messing up the mould. I do own a Hoch mould That I no longer use. It came with a set of instructions It said to use mould prep inside the cavity. Paul says to use nothing inside the cavity.Hoch says to flux every 20-40 bullets. Paul fluxes once. What paul also says is to press against the right side of the mould at the lower right corner with the handle of the soft mallet. This has always worked for me 75% of the time the bullet falls out when you open the handles. If not, 1 or 2 taps to inside handle that is holding the mould half with the bullet still in it. When this no longer works and I need to hit it 5-6 times there is something wrong. It has something to do with the pins and nothing more. I would send it to Paul and he Would "adjust" it and it would come back working perfect again. Remember the Hoch that I don't use any more? That's because I tried to adjust those pins and screwed it up.Can any body out there tell me How to adjust a PJ mould?
  I would like to throw something else out to you. If you study what is happening as you slowly open a mould after it sets up you will see that by applying pressure with a stick on the right side at different points as you are spreading the handles apart you can make the bullet come out without hitting the mould. On my mould right now if i press at the center of the right block, the top of the right half lets say the center line of the bullet. It will come out every time! But there seems to be a price to pay. This method  in a way rips the bullet out,and is causing a very slight bit of  damage to the opposite
side of the bullet just on the 45 deg. angle inside the last lube groove it's hard to even see but it's there. Is this little defect something worth living with if every bullet just falls out of my mould each time? Also these bullets are for silhoutte not bench rest target shooting.

Bob H.
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #1 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 9:17pm
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Just cast 200 bullets tonight with the R&J locking mould handles and a Boomer Money Nose Mould.

Never hit the mould even once. Every bullet dropped out as soon as I released the locking handle. Best mould I have ever used for proper dropping of bullets without any hang ups.

I have shot some fantastic targets with bullets from Paul Jones moulds, but they would never consistently drop bullets like my Boomer Moulds. Since Paul is no longer making moulds I have been trying out the Boomer moulds.

I never used any mould prep or release agent.
The mould stayed clean and dropped bullets as I cast them. Never used flux either. 

Locking handles line up and place mould in correct position. You do not get lead in between the mould halves that lead to misalignment and bullet flashing.
Mould stays cleaner and bullets drop out easier.
« Last Edit: Mar 15th, 2014 at 6:12pm by Schuetzendave »  
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JS47
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #2 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 12:57am
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Have you tried smoking the mold cavities with a kitchen match?
  
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ClaMar
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #3 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 10:20am
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Any of you who have done business with Paul Jones, know that he gave pretty specific instructions.  Cut the sprue (I do that with a gloved hand), tap the hinge pin (I use a small rawhide mallet), and then open the mould.  If the bullet doesn't fall out, tap the hinge pin once or twice.

I've found that advice to work well with all brands of moulds.

If a bullet consistently hangs in one side or the other and requires significant effort to dislodge, the cavity is likely cut off-center.

One other thing that can sometimes cause bullets to hang is casting too hot and fast.  Remember that the lead alloy shrinks very slightly as it solidifies and cools.  That shrinkage must be adequate to allow air between the bullet and cavity; if no air can get in, a vacuum exists.  On several of my moulds, slowing the cadence slightly solves sticking problems.

Clarence
  
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Hi-Wall56
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #4 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 2:01pm
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Schuetzendave,
I have considered using one of the locking mould handles and the one in your pic looks to be well made.  I would appreciate the full company name and contact info for the "RJ" locking mould handle you mentioned.
Hi-wall56
  
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.22-5-40
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #5 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 3:42pm
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Sometimes in working with old Ideal or early Lyman moulds..even though you have de-burred and even lightly lapped cavitiy, bullets still stick..after sprue is cut,  "flick" open handles with back of fingers of left hand..and at same time, strike a light sharp blow to handle hinge pin..this usually gets e'm out.
  
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #6 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 6:05pm
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For U.S. buyers R&J Mould Handles can be purchased through Shiloh Sharps:

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

or they can be bought from Ron Jordan the manufacturer in Saskatchewan, Canada.

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Boomer Moulds:

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

« Last Edit: Mar 15th, 2014 at 6:21pm by Schuetzendave »  
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Iron Coyote
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #7 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 6:54pm
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Have had the same results as Dave with the R&J Handles & Boomers Molds.
Both guys are good people & great to deal with.
My 2 cents worth.
THNX LOTS
Bob
  
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #8 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 7:58pm
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Schuetzendave wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 9:17pm:

Never used flux either. 


How do you deal with oxidation?

I ask because I recently stopped using fluxing agents.  The current process is to stir the pot until the light, fluffy dross rises to the top and skim it off.  It takes about five times as long as when I added beeswax but the results seem to be the same.

JackHughs
  

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JLouis
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #9 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 9:10pm
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I flux with my Javelina Schuetzen Lube and I have never encountered an oxidation problem. Put a pea sized piece in the pot, ignite it and stir it very vigorously and I usually get a little over two heaping teaspoons full of black dirt / dross. Alloy is pre-alloyed 1-20 and purchased from RotoMetals. If I don't stir it as noted above I might only get a partial teaspoon full of black dirt / dross. I believe the key might be how you stir while doing the fluxing?

JLouis
  

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Cat_Whisperer
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #10 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 11:06pm
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Stirring method does make a difference, as does the material with which one stirs.  I use both an ice-tea spoon and then a wooden paint stirrer.

  

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Schuetzendave
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #11 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 11:59pm
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I do not flux.

The lead:tin alloy has the lowest melting point.

As soon as the alloy starts to melt the dross and impurities float to the surface before the pot gets too hot to melt them as well.

I scoop the dross off and discard it.

I do not like fluxing since it can drive some impurities back into my alloy.

This procedure gives me a cleaner purer alloy.

I have been using this procedure for over twenty years.
  
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joeb33050
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #12 - Mar 16th, 2014 at 5:29am
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I let the pot and mold heat up for ~an hour is best.
I may flux, then scrape off the stuff.
As I ladle cast I get stuff in the ladle, stick the ladle nozzle in some Darr lube and keep casting.
Some silvery light stuff floats to the top and becomes bothersome. I scrape it up and put it aside. I'll do this ?3-4 times in a 1.5 hour casting session.
At the end of the session I put the light silvery stuff, maybe 3-4 ladles full, in the pot. Melts, then Darr lube in, flames, stir, and the silver goes away leaving black/grey floating powdery stuff. In the can to be thrown away.
The powdery stuff in the can is dense = DENSE, this is some metal or oxide of metal, don't know.
Bullet weight does NOT change as casting goes on, so if it is oxide, all constituents oxidize together. The tin ain't segregating.
I've been doing it this way since Eisenhower.
  
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joeb33050
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #13 - Mar 16th, 2014 at 5:51am
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Back to the original post. The last time I cast, 3/4/14,  I got 155 good bullets in ~45 minutes with 3 rejects-had to quit casting. On 3/3/14 258 good bullets and 5 rejects in just under 1.5 hours. 
"Good"= no flaws under 4X lighted magnifier.
Both with 225646 Modified, DC Lyman mold.
3/1/14 95 good, 5 rejects, ~30 minutes, LBT 22665SP
3/1/14 182 good. 14 rejects, ~1.5 hours, LBT22512SP

In a 1.5 houir session I cast ~150 30-32 caliber bullets and about 100 45 caliber bullets.

This while whacking the mold/handles as needed to get the bullets out. So, where's the problem? Whacking a mold/handles with a plastic mallet or stick never hurt a mold, and time ain't the problem. I shoot ~100 bullets at a range session, all experiments. 10 shots in ~20 minutes = 15 min shoot 5 min change targets. That's 30 an hour, 100 in ~ 3 hours + BS = 4 hours and I'm done.
So, a 32 cal range session takes 1 hour to cast for. 
Where's the problem? Whack that mold!
  
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boho
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Re: Mould tune up Part @
Reply #14 - Mar 16th, 2014 at 10:25am
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Thanks  all. But you are missing the point. There will come a time when a PJ mould needs adjusting. Keep banging on the mould over and over and at some point one or two or all of the pins will start to move. They do not have to move much to cause problems. Pauls moulds are made with 3 alinement pins each has a champher at the top and a corresponding champher in the 3 holes.It is the champhers that aline the mould. if the pins move in even only .001" then the two halfs when put together and twisted will move this is a fact. If the pin or pins move out even as little as .001" the mould can not close completely another fact. Paul knew this and he could adjust or "tune it up" if you sent it in to him. He advised strongly against trying it at home. He must have had a special jig for re-setting his mould blocks/pins. I was hoping someone had figured this out and had a plan. I was not looking for advise on casting bullets, fluxing or any of the other responses but thank you just the same. Don't think that you can just hammer these pins in or out or put them under a arbor or hydraulic press and move them. They are very hard to move and it's easy to slip and ruin the mould block. The correct length of the pins from the face of the mould to the champher is critical with only .001" to .002" +/- to get it right. Now can the machinist and engineers out there come up with a idea for a fixture.
  
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