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RobertS
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Another Stevens Rifle
Jan 2nd, 2013 at 10:42pm
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I am new at this, and for years didn't see many of these, but recently picked up this Stevens rifle at an auction.  It has a heavy round barrel about 1 inch diameter, built on a 44 action, and caliber was unmarked.  After I got it home, I removed the forend and the underside of the barrel is marked H M POPE, and while I didn't know this when I bought it, I still am a little skeptical about it, as the spacing of the letters is a little uneven.  I made a cast of the chamber, and am pretty sure it is a 25-20 SS.   The face of the action is marked with a 44 and  a O, and the barrel has 3 v shaped marks near the action, so I wonder whether they are significant.  The bore had a little dust, but cleaned up very nicely and looks great, and the action is missing the extractor and mainspring, it seems, as the lever and hammer are pretty floppy as it is.  I'm wondering what to do now, as I am pretty confident that I could replace the spring and extractor, and I've got some good books and have done some reading about breech seating, etc., but if it might be a legit Pope barrel, should I not shoot it?  I appreciate the wealth of information here, and look forward to hearing what you guys think.  By the way, it had a Fecker scope,with the numbers 6836, which I am not sure if that is a model or serial number. 
« Last Edit: Jan 2nd, 2013 at 11:26pm by RobertS »  
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RobertS
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #1 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 10:56pm
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Here's another picture, (still learning)
  
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JLouis
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #2 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 11:34pm
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Besides the HM Pope stamping be questionable it is also lacking the additional data Harry put on his barrels.
  

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uscra112
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #3 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 2:39am
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It should be possible to do a slug and observe whether it has the unique rifling form he used.   That would be the clincher IMHO.

Phil

  

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RobertS
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #4 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 9:34am
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I have been pondering the idea of using a tightly patched cleaning rod or dowel with a pointer to try to measure the pitch of the twist, to see if there is a perceptible change in the pitch of the rifling from chamber to muzzle.  I may try that tonight.  The barrel is a little over 24 inches long, so I don't know if that is sufficiently long enough for me to be able to tell, but it is probably worth a try.  If anyone can suggest a better method, I'm all ears.  Thanks again!
  
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MAD MIKE
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #5 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 4:40pm
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Rob, Just look thru the darn bore, is it a left hand twist & are the grooves flat? The mainspring & extractor are available at Wisner's.     ...MIKE...
  
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JLouis
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #6 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 7:49pm
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To add to what Mike said you should also be able to see the gain. Keep in mind that Pope is not the only one who made left hand gain twist barrels so it will actually in all reality prove nothing. When looking at the name on the barrel it appears to me that someone was trying to pull a fast one as it is was very unprofessionally done and is pretty much the opposite of Pope's high standards. I might add his name was generally located on the exposed part of the barrel for all the world to see, the barrel number, dates etc. were hidden under the forearm.

J.Louis
  

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RobertS
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #7 - Jan 4th, 2013 at 12:17am
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Thanks, it is right hand twist, and looking down the bore I can't really tell if the pitch increases or not, so I guess I'm probably not going to jeapordize anything by taking it out and shooting it then?  It came from the estate of a professional gunsmith, so there's no telling what the real story behind it might be.  By the way, I hope that doesn't offend any of you professional gunsmiths out there!  Thanks again for the great information, and I'll check with Wisener's for the spring and extractor.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #8 - Jan 4th, 2013 at 1:03pm
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Not a surprise Robert. Harry Pope's name is probably the most commonly forged name ever stamped on a gun! Some are obvious fakes, while some take a very astute eye to determine. Some are just too good to even know if they do everything right, including the rifling. Most never go that far.
  

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ledball
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #9 - Jan 4th, 2013 at 3:19pm
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RobertS, I think Pope also made barrels with a right hand twist so, just because it is not left hand twist does not mean its not a Pope.   ledball
  
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terry buffum
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #10 - Jan 6th, 2013 at 12:58am
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The right hand twist Pope barrels I've seen are for cartridges associated with smokeless powder (.30-06, .30/.405, 7.5 Swiss, 7 x 57 etc), and for those by Stevens Pope for the .30-40 Krag.  I don't recall any for black powder era cartridges like the original poster's .25-20 (S.S. most likely on a 44 action) that are right hand twist.
  

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harry_eales
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #11 - Jan 6th, 2013 at 12:14pm
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I believe that the H.M.Pope stampings on the barrel were done individually as there is a slight inconsistance in their alignment. It is known that Harry Pope had a die stamp to apply his name and many pictures of these exist, and there are no imperfections in the genuine stamp.

Still, it's a nice looking rifle and I would be happy to own it.

Harry
  
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40_Rod
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #12 - Jan 7th, 2013 at 9:00am
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There is one other possibility, that is that someone who had a heavy Pope barrel had it turned down to make weight. After the smith turned it down and removed all the information he stamped Pope's name on it so others would know it was a Pope. 
If it has Pope style rifling it should be sent to someone who can make an educated guess.

40 Rod
  
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Re: Another Stevens Rifle
Reply #13 - Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:45pm
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I recently acquired a Stevens-Pope 44 Schuetzen in .28-30 Stevens, it also has a left hand twist. Can't tell if it is a gain twist just by looking through the bore. Will have to use the cleaning rod method.
Tom
  
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