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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet (Read 14513 times)
RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #15 - Oct 5th, 2012 at 4:18pm
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I pulled a bullet from the Winchester factory ammo to measure.

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Interesting how little powder was in the case. And it looks like 3031.

The bullet was only .375, but as you can see above, they shot like a house-a-fire!
  
Roy B
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RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #16 - Oct 5th, 2012 at 7:36pm
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I went into the shop tonight and cast a bunch of lead bullets with the Lee mold. I made 30 out of pure lead and 30 out of 20-1 alloy. All the bullets measured .379 while barely warm. I'll measure again tomorrow after they cool completely. Then I'll lod them with smokeless and BP and see what happens.

And I went into a small local gun shop today and they had two more boxes of this Winchester factory stuff ($45 a box!!!) and two boxes of very old Winchester 38-55 with $2.95 on the boxes! And a half box of Peters 38-55 with 18 cents each written on the box.

The store owner wanted $200 per box for the old Winchester...!! (But he ended up giving me the half box of Peters)

So at least I can take the Sharps hunting in a few weeks, but I really wanted to use my own lead bullets
  
Roy B
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #17 - Oct 5th, 2012 at 8:54pm
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Just for fun, load a few hard cast with 9gr unique, no  filler  wlr primer aw good crimp, its my  favorite load for 200yd off hand...  ya I know its pistol powder...
  
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RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #18 - Oct 6th, 2012 at 2:16am
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I keep hearing that Unique is a great powder for the 38-55 and the 45-70. I'll pick some up at the big gun show I'm going to today.
  
Roy B
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #19 - Oct 6th, 2012 at 7:43am
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Use it in 32-40, 38-55, 40-65, 45-70..  to test rifle with different bullets, I take about 20 pills and machine the base flat if it has a small angle just to see if they group better,  I also use Uniq in 25-20, and 32-20 with great results..   
I started loadin in or about 1955, and started saving old Lyman books..  lota useful info in them about Uniq.. 

in the process of testing 800X and Blue Dot to see if they can duplicate results of Uniq..
  
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RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #20 - Oct 6th, 2012 at 8:07pm
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Well I got back to the 38-55 saga.....

The bullets I cast measued as such:

Pure Lead = .379.0
20-1 Alloy = .380.5

I turned an expansion plug on my lathe to .381 and loaded five of each bullet with 8 and 9 grains of Unique for a total of twenty rounds. Tomorrow I'll test.

Stay tuned!
  
Roy B
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.22-5-40
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #21 - Oct 6th, 2012 at 8:25pm
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Hello, RoyB.  Have you 4227 yet?  In my original Winchester High Wall (.479 groove), I am getting excellent accuracy with 18.0grs using the Lyman 375248 cast 20-1.  I seat so first band is fully engraved by rifling.
  
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RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #22 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 3:55pm
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Update!

Went to the range today to try my own cast bullets. It was raining so I didn't have much time.

Put a target out at 50 yards and shot four, three shot groups with two different lead hardness and two different powder charges.

Here is pure lead at .379 with 8g of Unique:
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Here is pure lead at .379 with 9g of Unique:
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Here is 20-1 at .3815 with 8g of Unique:
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And saving the best for last....Here is 20-1 at .3815 with 9g of Unique!!!:
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50 yards in the rain with the barrel resting on my range bag and no rear rest......60 year old eyes with iron sights! The cleaning patches were there as point of aim. I simply wet them and stuck them on the paper.....

Can't understand why the store bought .379 bullets tumbled but the ones I cast at the same diameter didn't. Has to be all about hardness as the two bullets are within thousandths of each other in length.

More testing is needed, but to say I'm a happy camper would be an understatement!
  
Roy B
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #23 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 4:21pm
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Now that ya are using UniQ,   next test is to go back to the range and use some kinda sand bags,   Now dont flame me yet, but rest the barrel on the bags just about 3 or 4 inches from the mussel, and pin the stock down on your left forearm, and squez aw few off,  let us kno what hoppenes..  the last node is usually 3 or 4" from the mussel...
  
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RoyB
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #24 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 5:14pm
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Thanks for the tip. These were shot with the barrel resting on the range bag. I usually use a "period correct" benchrest that I built:

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or cross sticks from a prone, kneeling or sitting position:

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To find the barrels node, I sprinkle baby powder on the top of the barrel and fire a shot. The powder will clearly identify the node......I kid you not!
  
Roy B
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #25 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 5:38pm
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nice woodwork...
  
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #26 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 5:58pm
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RoyB wrote on Oct 7th, 2012 at 5:14pm:
To find the barrels node, I sprinkle baby powder on the top of the barrel and fire a shot. The powder will clearly identify the node......I kid you not!

Assume you do this off-hand?
  
Glenn - 2x CPA 44 1/2 w/22LR (Shilen ratchet-rifled & Bartlein 5R rifled), 38-40RH & 38-55WCF (Bartlein 5R rifled) & 40-65WCF (GrnMtn 'X') barrels
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John Boy
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Re: Strange Goings On at the Range.....Tumbling bullet
Reply #27 - Oct 7th, 2012 at 6:38pm
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Quote:
Assume you do this off-hand?

Yes ... old gunsmith's trick
*  Sprinkle the powder along the top flat
*  Off hand, the node will be at the X point of the powder where it changes direction ... which will look like this <<<<<<<<<X>>>>>>>>>>
Mark the X and repeat for confidence
PS - Don't sneeze! Grin
Best to relieve the forearm wood next to the receiver the width of a playing card so the vibration doesn't interfere with the real node point

And rule of thumb - the node will usually be about 7" from the muzzle
I use the brass hammer procedure with the forearm removed.  Then paint a band of paint on the top flat.  The plastic space gun guys always ask - 'Why do you paint your rifle?"  Wink

« Last Edit: Oct 7th, 2012 at 6:44pm by »  
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