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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley (Read 80825 times)
Red Cent
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #90 - May 1st, 2020 at 1:22pm
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Over a half a century ago, I became aware of a load that was  ubiquitous in nature. It was the 38 Special load of 2.7 grs of Bullseye with a 148 gr full wadcutter. As usual there were a few blowups and they could not solve the mystery. I would suspect there were not any confessions forthcoming. The popular conclusion: detonation.
Until this day they have never been able to produce the same results in any lab. And the internet is rife with tests ran. 
SASS/Cowboy Action Shooting has the same (somewhat) circumstance.  We are noted for our light (woose) loads and it was determined that it was detonation. No confessions here either. 
I must admit that I strongly believe when this happens, then it is the reloader and not the load.
  

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oneatatime
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #91 - May 1st, 2020 at 2:51pm
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I would think that a 148 gr full wadcutter takes up an awful lot of case capacity. Pressure is probably right up there like what happens to 40s when the bullet gets jammed down in the case. A double load would be very exciting.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #92 - May 1st, 2020 at 6:03pm
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It was said that the pictured blown up Ballard was loaded with 5744, and a wad over the powder. The combination of the 5744 double base powder, with a wad against it certainly was more than a lot of receivers could hold. 
Since this incident the Quigley has banned the use of 5744 or some other double base powders. I don't think 5744 is a bad powder, just bad when you put a wad down against it.
As I type I have to admit I have a couple cast action Ballards chambered in .32-40 caliber, and have shot them too many times to count. They are certainly strong enough for sane people to reload for. They might not be safe enough for everyone, as some just like to push the limits. And I wouldn't build up such a gun, as these both came to me having been shot for many decades, and I hope to shoot them just as long.
  

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Mick B
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #93 - May 1st, 2020 at 10:12pm
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Shoot smokeless powder in black powder rifles and you deserve what you get, shame about the rifle though.
Mike.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #94 - May 1st, 2020 at 10:51pm
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Mick B wrote on May 1st, 2020 at 10:12pm:
Shoot smokeless powder in black powder rifles and you deserve what you get, shame about the rifle though.
Mike.


None of my dozens of Ballard rifles have ever seen BP in them since I've owned them. They're not complaining about being fed with smokeless.
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #95 - May 2nd, 2020 at 9:18am
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No doubt some smokeless powders work and prove themselves safe in these old rifles but under no circumstances will I use 5744 in my rifles. In years past I used it but after seeing the pictures of a destroyed 1903-A3, a rifle build to take extreme pressures, and no know reason for the destruction that powder is off my list until it is proven the cause was otherwise.
  
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scharfe
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #96 - May 2nd, 2020 at 10:13am
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It's a shame that things like this happen. I used to warn unknowing people especially when they are trying to sell. Most of the time they think you're trying to lowball them. There's a cast ballard frame that's cracked on Ebay now. 
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Can it be fixed, yep. Would it make a dandy .22, you bet. May it become someone's new BPCR, who knows.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #97 - May 2nd, 2020 at 10:55am
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Considering the crack, and it being a stripped action, I'd never consider it myself. I do have enough parts to assemble a complete action, but wouldn't waste or use them on that action unless somebody gave it to me.
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #98 - May 2nd, 2020 at 12:29pm
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To bad he didn't have the cadmium plated Parkenfarker fix installed.
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #99 - May 2nd, 2020 at 12:35pm
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No body is self deserving to get hurt or harmed. As Vall said in the past twenty seven years my BP rifles have never had BP being used in any of them to date. So are you saying we both deserve to have a rifle blow up, be hurt or to harm somebody else near by?
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #100 - May 2nd, 2020 at 12:55pm
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John, who are you asking?
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #101 - May 2nd, 2020 at 1:23pm
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There is an article written in the January / February 2013 Single Shot Rifle Journal Vol. 66 No.1 about this action. It was a cast action and in 40-65 according to SSDave who also noted the load as being 20 or 22 grains of AA5744 who has stated he was also there at the time. The article by Bob Carow in the Journal was more specific to the weakness of the cast actions and to the whys and not specific to the accident itself.
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #102 - May 2nd, 2020 at 1:29pm
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Yes sir, we should only use smokeless in modern actions;-)
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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #103 - May 2nd, 2020 at 1:31pm
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He who mentioned in an earlier post those shooting smokeless in a BP rifle deserve what they get. It was a bit odd coming from him he is a real nice guy but the comment itself seemed a bit out of place.
  

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Re: Ballard Action Blow-up at the Quigley
Reply #104 - May 2nd, 2020 at 1:53pm
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The topic of old BP era guns, and BP vs. smokeless powders is always a hot topic. The purists are always saying BP is the safest and only way to go with any gun built before 1898 or there about. Those smart enough to know which smokeless powders to use, and how to load correctly also will never have any problems. 
There are numerous cases of shooters using smokeless powders to blow up brand new guns too, so maybe smokeless shouldn't be used in any gun, regardless of age if the person loading them doesn't have some special training, and a state license before he reloads? I'm sure some government agency could make us all safer, and we wont worry about what others are doing.
  

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