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oughtsix
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need a casting doctor
Aug 18th, 2011 at 5:08pm
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I just bought a Lyman 38 mould 378674 and am having troubles with it. I cleaned it with denatured alcohol, sprayed it with "Drop Out" and went to work.  I use a Cabine tree locking mould handle.    The first 5 bullets  out were picture perfect.  Then I notice the grooves on one side were not square, then the bullets came out frosted, like every thing was too hot.  After about 30 minutes of trying to get the temp down ( adding lead, lowering the temp on  the Lee pot, leaving the blocks open to cool) and still getting frosty bullets, I quit for the day.   Day 2 -  cleaned again with alcohol, got wrinkled bullets for about 45 minutes, quit again.  Day 3,   more alcohol, wiped dry with lint free cloth, let them sit for a few hours at room temp, started again.  at  650 700 750 800 and 850 degrees I got almost the same bullet (see photo)   after a few castings at 850, one side of the bullet frosted, but was otherwise perfect.  the wrinkled side was nice and shiny.    I did notice than if you hold the closed handles up to the light, you can see light throught the mould.  I can see light through another Lyman mould,  but not through my Darr, Saeco, zika.    I don't know if it is me,  my 30:1 lead, or the mould,  or misalignment  of Venus and Mars,   but  I need some suggestions on what to do.   

thanks, 

-06
  

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #1 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 5:18pm
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It's hard for Internet experts to say whats wrong from one picture.  However since we are anonymous and don't have to account for our advice here's mine.

Most problems like the one pictured are due to inconsistent temperature. Lead has to be hot but so does the dipper mold and all, Mold too cool it cools the lead inconsistent.  I would heat up the pot, prop the mold up against it so heat transfers and brings the block's up the a nice high even heat then try it again

If you are bottom pouring might try switching to a dipper. If all else fails holding the dipper in contact with the blocks after you pour keeps the heat transfer even and lets things fill out nice.  Even though the metal has transferred  dipper adding to the mold heat will help keep the bullet liquid and able to fill out better

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #2 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 8:41pm
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If you see light between the mold blocks I'd check the alignment pins in the cavity face side of the blocks. Every Lyman mold I bought new had to have the pin height adjusted lower. 

To do that I take the mold out of the handles, place the mold in a vice with the aluminum jaw protectors, and locate the mold so the vice jaws close on the pins on one side with the backside of the mold facing the other jaw. It takes alot of force sometimes to move the pins but they only have to move a few thousandths. Try the block on the other half and look for the light. Repeat until the light goes away. Don't worry, if you go too far you can use a punch on the backside of the pin and push it back out. I make one final check and try twisting the mold blocks relative to each other. If they rotate even a small amout, you can get pronounced mold parting lines and out of round bullets. Again, to get rid of these is a pin height adjustment. 

Looking at the bullet, I'd guess the temp of the mold or alloy is too low. I use a coffee cup warmer to pre heat the mold on or even an aluminum plate on my back packing stove. Another thing is the alloy. Too little tin and bullets can look like that. 

Hope that helps
Ed
  
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oughtsix
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #3 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 9:05pm
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This just in.    My son told  me that one block fell on the garage floor  between day  1 and 2.   Could a drop bend the blocks?   

I'll try Mi-shooters advice,  but I think I found the cause.

-06
  

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #4 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 9:14pm
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I doubt that dropping the block would bend it, but it probably raised a burr on an edge that's keeping the blocks out of alignment.   

David
  

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #5 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 9:45pm
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-06, the bullet picture is indicative of poor head pressure when pouring the melt.
* Scrub the mold cavity with Brake Cleaner, not alcohol ... when the mold is cold
* Heat the melt up to between 710-730 for that 335gr bullet
* Heat the mold up on a gas burner
* Mold and melt at temperature ... take a full ladle scoop of lead
* Tilt the mold horizontal - put the ladle spout tightly into the sprue hole - turn the mold vertical (spout still tight in hole)
*  Pour for 5 seconds with a nice puddle
*  If the sprue puddle frosts @ approx 5 seconds, your melt temperature is correct.  KEY ... If not, adjust temp accordingly 

Try it and let's see a bullet picture.  Make sure to include the bullet base - it should be 'razor' sharp

  
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #6 - Aug 18th, 2011 at 10:53pm
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One other thing is, you should not get frosting if your using 30/1 lead and tin. I'm guessing that you have other things in it. The mix after it cools should still be mostly shiney.

I always wash my with either dish soap, or Boraxo and HOT water with a toothe brush.
 
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #7 - Aug 19th, 2011 at 8:14am
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OK I'll add my two-cents. 
First check the mould to make sure it closes correctly. If it has been dropped and fell on an inside corned you may have raised a corner. Check to see that the faces are flat. Now that we know that the mould is OK wash it with good hot water and a toothbrush dry it right away and then clean it with break cleaner. Smoke the mould with a match or use some mould prep on it. If you use mould prep remember your not painting a barn door a light even coat will do. Now we are ready to try casting.
  You didn't mention what alloy, if any you are using. This is important different alloys will want to cast at different temperatures. For 30:1 lead tin I use 825 for 18:1 I am using about 750. If you are using an alloy that has antimony in it it is going to want to be on the cool side. 
  Now set the mould on the edge of the pot Make sure that the sprue plate is touching the pot, turn it on and walk away for 45 minutes or so. This will let the metal melt and fully come to temperature and if there is any moisture anywhere you will not be there when the metal pops from steam. 
  Now start casting. Cast anywhere 10 to 15 bullets before you start to save them it will take you that many for the mould to come up to a casting temperature that will give you good consistent bullets. Work on a good consistent rhythm, Make sure that you are holding the mould square and that the hole is directly over the hole in the sprue plate. If you tip it even a little you will get inconsistent pressure and your bullets will reflect that. 
From what I saw either you have contaminants on your mould, silicone can be very hard to get out, or your casting temperature is too low. 
The rhythm I like to use is hold the mould square when the sprue goes hard count to 3 and push, don't hit, the sprue plate open. and pop out the bullet.
As always your mileage mat vary.

40 Rod
  
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #8 - Aug 19th, 2011 at 9:33am
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Need a casting doctor?  No such thing!  Welcome to bullet casting!  Keep casting, you'll figure it out, lol.

        Joe.   Smiley

     
  

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #9 - Aug 19th, 2011 at 8:54pm
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So I used the following advice:

I set the alignment pins back a hair (MI- shooter was right,  it took some force)
I scrubbed with hot soapy water, let dry
rinsed with Brake cleaner

I could still see daylight through the bottom

I lightly sprayed  with drop out  and the light went away. 

I casted about 50 near perfect bullets at ~750 degrees  that were NOT shiny, but hazy finished.

not content to leave well enough alone,  I rinsed out the Drop Out with brake cleaner (the light reappeared)   the next bullets out were bright shiny and winkled  (still ~750)   After about 10 bullets,  I  just dusted the bottom of the mould halves with the drop out,  that blocked the light.  The bullets came out  perfectly shaped but hazy.  The bullets may be casting the shape of the graphite ??

I may tighten the mould handles down to see if I can squeeze the light out and see if that gets me shiny perfect bullets.  But I've enough bullets to kill some paper,  so off to the range,   

thanks to all who offered advice,

oughtsix

  

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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #10 - Aug 19th, 2011 at 9:35pm
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If you still see light, the mold is not closing right. Since the mold was dropped, check for a raised corner with a good flat edge, moving it over each mold half. Check corners and edges as that is likely where the burr would be. Lightly stone down any raised spot. You only want to remone the high spot, not the whole surface.

Ed
  
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #11 - Aug 20th, 2011 at 11:07am
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I pre-heat my molds on a hot plate and get good bullets right from the start.
  
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Re: need a casting doctor
Reply #12 - Aug 20th, 2011 at 5:56pm
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Beware of using heat on the mold after using break cleaner, be sure it has all evaporated. Some  of that stuff is pretty nasty stuff around flames or high heat. Read an article one of the big name bike builders made the mistake of welding after using brake cleaner, put him in the hospital. That said I use it as well for cleaning my moulds
  
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