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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Firing Pin Alloy? (Read 21350 times)
Green_Frog
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Firing Pin Alloy?
Jul 3rd, 2010 at 9:33pm
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I just picked up my old 1873 Model Maynard and the back half of the firing pin fell out on the floor.  This one is a replacement made for me by a reputable 'smith, but these rifles have a reputation for being rough on firing pins.  I don't dry fire it... I even modified a Pachmayr snap cap to keep in the chamber to protect the pin, but break it did!  Cry  The fracture line looks as though it crystallized and it goes straight across under the front of the cross notch that the retaining screw passes through.  Undecided

SOOO, I am going to make it myself this time and would like to get some advice on what to use.  I am leaning toward air hardening tool steel, but that's just a "stab in the dark."  Does anyone want to chime in and agree or to suggest something that might work better?  As always, TIA for any help or suggestions.  Wink

Froggie
  
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Cat_Whisperer
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #1 - Jul 3rd, 2010 at 10:28pm
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Doing a quick search in the internet gives lots of firing pins and little info on materials, other than titanium AR-15 pins and 4130 being used for 1911 extractors.  A hint of 4140 on some other firing pin.  Someone mentioned that Brownell's used to stock metal for making them.

It has to withstand shock and not crack.  That to me says good hardening and tempering.

8620 is used for M-16 bolts for those qualities.

  

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #2 - Jul 3rd, 2010 at 10:34pm
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what about the beryllium/bronze alloy stuff.  supposed to be incredible durable.  seems like I remember a discussion about it some while back
  

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westerner
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #3 - Jul 3rd, 2010 at 11:18pm
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I'd make the body out of mild steel. Then I'd use a piece of music wire/piano wire the correct size. Drill the body so the pin is a tight fit. Harden the body with Kasenit then drive the wire in.  I have some made like that and they will not break or wear out. Why would a Maynard be Harder on pins than other actions? 

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singleshotsam
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #4 - Jul 3rd, 2010 at 11:54pm
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  Over the years I have made numerous firing pins for various SS rifles from Ballard's to Stevens and Remington's from O-1 drill rod. My process has been to turn the pins in the lathe and perform any cuts required for retainer screws or pins. Then polish to remove any machine marks. Heat to cherry red with a propane torch and quench in 30 weight motor oil. Carefully remove all scale (I use glass beads) and then smoke the pin with a candle. To temper I use my lead pot set to 650 degrees and drop the smoked pin into the molten lead and leave it there for 30 minutes. The soot from the candle will prevent the lead from sticking to the firing pin. Remove from the lead pot allow to cool and wipe any remaining lead off. Install in the breech block and double check for free movement and you should be ready to head to the range. I have had two out of dozens made this way fail, so it is not perfect but but has kept many rifles going over the years.

SSS
  
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jfeldman
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #5 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 12:02am
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Froggy - I had a gunsmith/friend tell me to go to the hardware store and buy a socket head screw (allen head) of the right diameter and machine it to the right size without creating too much heat and then use it as is.  I've done so a couple of times with good results.  FWIW.  Good luck!
Regards, Joe

PS  As SS Sam says, polishing is crucial.
  
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John Taylor
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #6 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 3:06am
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I use spring steel out of junk cars. The springs that are used in the trunk lid come in a lot of different sizes and work good for firing pins and screws. No heat treat after as they are already just about right. They can be cut with a file or hacksaw but still hard enough to hold up to the hammer strike without mushrooming. Drill rod is to hard after heat treat and can break easy.
Check the fit of the pin, if it is to sloppy it can break. If the hole for the pin is worn crooked the pin can break. You may need to bore the hole out to make it strait and lined up with the smaller diameter part of the hole. The hole could also be bushed to take up for ware.
« Last Edit: Jul 4th, 2010 at 3:12am by John Taylor »  

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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #7 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 3:17am
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   I've had good luck with 4340. You should be able to get it "off the shelf" from an industrial steel supplier already heat treated at 32 to 36 Rockwell "C". Easily worked with files but pretty darn tough. 
   Or what John says.  Smiley
                                       SteveC
  
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Singleshotlover
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #8 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 3:24am
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I remember reading about S-7 steel being used for firing pins. I have made a couple from drill rod and grade 5 heat treated bolts. Just a suggestion. Frank
  
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #9 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 7:00am
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Froggy,

You can use 1117 screw stock to make the machining easy on yourself PROVIDED you can then give it to someone who will properly case-harden it afterward... perhaps throw it in the bone-char with some scope mount bases and other small parts etc.
  

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screwloosetc
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #10 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 7:20am
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Charlie
What are the dimentions of this pin?
Tom
  
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FITZ
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #11 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 2:25pm
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Frog, I have been going to 17-4 PH stainless steel. This is a magnetic heat treatable Stainless. Heat treat is real easy. Put it in a oven at 900 deg F for 15 minutes to come up to oven temp. And then let it soak in oven for 1 hour. Take out and let it air cool to room temp and it will be right at 40 Rc, tough but not brittle hard. Caution do not cool it with air blast or air gun just lay it on a brick and let it cool off. A bead blast to clean up after heat treat does not hurt either. I make prototype operating instruments from this stuff all the time. They hold up well under hard use by Doctors and it also makes a very good spring. Just make to size and shape and heat treat and bead blast and it is ready for use. I can send you some if you wish I will be returning to work on 7/8 and can get you some of a close or correct diameter. let me know what diameter you need, I will send you the nearest oversize we have or material to size if we have it in stock. You will need to find someone with a real heat treat oven as the 900 F is a critical temperature for this material. HTH. Regards, FITZ. Smiley
  

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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #12 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 4:30pm
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Respectable stuff:
17-4 Precipitation Hardening also known as Type 630 is a chromium-copper precipitation hardening stainless steel used for applications requiring height strength and a moderate level of corrosion resistance. High strength is maintained to approximately 600 degrees Fahrenheit (316 degrees Celsius).

General Properties

Alloy 17-4 PH is a precipitation hardening martensitic stainless steel with Cu and Nb/Cb additions. The grade combines high strength, hardness (up to 572°F / 300°C), and corrosion resistance.

Mechanical properties can be optimized with heat treatment. Very high yield strength up to 1100-1300 MPa (160-190 ksi) can be achieved.

The grade should not be used at temperatures above 572°F (300°C) or at very low temperatures. It has adequate resistance to atmospheric corrosion or in diluted acids or salts where its corrosion resistance is equivalent to Alloy 304 or 430.
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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #13 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 4:34pm
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AND:
Principal Design Features
 
One of the most widely used precipitation hardening grades in the business. While soft and ductile in the solution annealed condition, it is capable of high properties with a single precipitation or aging treatment. Characterized by good corrosion resistance, high harness, toughness and strength.
 
Applications
Commonly used in both aircraft and gas turbines, nuclear reactor, paper mill, oil field, and chemical process components.


Machinability
Long, gummy chips characterize this alloys machinability. It can be machined in the annealed condition, however condition H1150M will yield best results. Post machining solution treatment of parts will be required prior to final hardening if machining in this condition.
 
Forming
This alloy is capable of being only mildly formed. If forming is required, do so in the overaged condition for best results.
 
Welding
Successfully welded by common fusion and resistance methods, this alloy should not be joined by oxyacetylene welding. AWS E/ER630 filler metal is recommended if required.
 
« Last Edit: Jul 4th, 2010 at 4:39pm by Cat_Whisperer »  

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Re: Firing Pin Alloy?
Reply #14 - Jul 4th, 2010 at 4:38pm
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Heat Treatment
CONDITION A--Soak at 1900 F (1038 C) for 30 minutes and cool below 60 F (16 C) for complete martensite transformation. CONDITION H 950- Treat Condition A material at 900 F(482 C) for 1 hour, air cool.. CONDITION H925, H1025, H1075, H1100, H1150- Soak solution treated material for 4 hours at specified temperature, air cool, CONDITION H1150M- Soak solution treated material at 1400 F (760 C) for 2 hours, air cool, then re-heat to 1150 F (620 C) for 4 hours and air cool.
 
Forging
Soak for 1 hour at 2150 F (1177 C) prior to forging. Do not work below 1850 F (1010 C). Post-work solution treatment is required prior to final hardening.
 
Hot Working
17-4 PH can be easily hot worked using most of the common processes. It is suggested that material be solution treated at 1900 F(1038 C) then formed during cooling while the material is still austenitic. Post-work solution treatment is required prior to final hardening.
 
Cold Working
Despite its high initial yield strength, 17-4 can be cold worked successfully by most common methods.
 
Annealing
1900 F (1038 C), hold for 1/2 hour, rapid cool.
 
Hardening
This alloy has good ductility and may be readily formed by all conventional methods. Because the alloy is stronger than regular steel it requires more powerful equipment to accomplish forming. Heavy-duty lubricants should be used during cold forming.
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