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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake (Read 13026 times)
John Boy
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Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:12pm
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At 100 and 200 yards, the bullet shot groups less than MOA! I am pleased with it's first maiden performance  Grin
BP recipes are included. And for the white powder folks, I don't see any reason why it wouldn't perform also.

For those not abreast about the knowledge of the bullet ... it was a 38-55 bullet that Ideal Mold had was a standard going back to the 1800's. When Lyman Products bought out Ideal in the early 70's, they sold off all Ideal inventory that was not 'profitable' sales. This 375166 mold was one. Since then, the mold design was totally forgotten about except for the very few mold collectors that had the mold. I have only been able to locate 2 owner's of the original.

Two years ago, in the Blackpowder Cartridge News, there was an article for BPCR bullets that the author modified from the Greenhill Formula. The ratio for the 375166 bullet calculated to 17.65 in a 1:18 twist barrel. My ticker skipped a beat! There was a 2 year endeavour to have Lyman remake the Ideal mold and there are now only 100 exact dimensions remake molds resulting from the 'group buy' purchase. I have 2 and based on today's range test ... they produce a bullet to be reckoned with in a 38-55 single shot rifle. 

If your interested, read this part of the thread on Shiloh Rifle ... (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
  
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westerner
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #1 - Jul 14th, 2009 at 11:31pm
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Hi John Boy. 

Just curious what rifle/barrel/twist you're using with the resurrected Lyman bullet? Also what is the difference in the two cherries used ? 

                                      Joe.

  

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John Boy
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #2 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 12:01am
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Uberti HiWall -  stock barrel - 1:18 with 371 lands and 378 grooves.  No difference in the 2 cherries used.  It was just that Lyman specified Lou Sellman, Lyman Distributor, had to buy 2 cherries (which he owns) for the remake of this mold
  
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #3 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 3:30pm
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John Boy,
The 375166 looks quite close to the 37579 that I have in the 325 grain weight. I was wondering if you may have been able to shoot both styles to make a comparison.
BP
  

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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #4 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 3:55pm
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John Boy, I forgot to ask if you're using a scope or irons.

I'm having a hard time trying to word this so I don't sound like a smart _ _ _.  Here goes anyway. I understand these three shot targets are the just the initial trial, but ten shot groups will show us how you are really doing. Most match's are ten shot strings. I don't know about you but things can go wrong in a long string that wont show up in a three shot string.  Smiley

                                            Joe.  Smiley

  

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John Boy
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #5 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 7:30pm
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(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) Ideal 37579   (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)Ideal 375166 
Joe, they look like 2 different bullets to me.  Ogive radius's are similar though.  No, I have never shot this bullet.  A current production 38-55 that I have had good results with is the Lyman 378674
#2 - On all my BPCRs - iron sights, LR verniers, except mid range ones on my gallery rifles.  I shoot 1000yds about 4 times a year and so far, the verniers haven't let me down - neither have my eyes  Smiley
#3 - I hear you about the 10 shot groups.  At this point, if it will shoot 3 then for 10 it should shoot the same barring no bad let offs or other goofy things that do happen.  You know what I'm saying.  Since this is a bullet that has never been flown in over 40 years, I wanted to see quickly if it would or never will be.  Today, I took another batch to the range with recipes different than the 1st batch.  I'm an x'perimenter and also am a devote fan of felt wads.  Today's batch had 3 variable changes and yes, I know it should only be one at a time.  Anyway, construction paper OPHW instead of Red Rosin paper - variable powder charges (42-44-45 and 48grs of Swiss 1.5) and 0.10 dry felt wads.  I also shot up the remaining 42gr Goex CTG from the 1st batch ... which is a coin toss with this bullet!  I'll post up the groups after I get them measured.  The groups today are holding in there to say, that the bullet is A-OK in my book.  And when I find the right recipe combination ... no looking back.  Then, I will shoot 10 shot groups based on the best recipe(s) group averages.


  
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John Boy
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #6 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 9:16pm
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Blindeye - yes, this Uberti is tight and both bore dimensions were measured accurately.  It's interesting - I shoot alos both the bullets you mentioned.  Not much on paper but on sillouhtes.  And the 378674 works better for me.  These Ideal bullets are not yawing at either 200 or 300yds.  Clean straight holes.   

Based on today's groups which ran about an inch larger at both 200 and 300 than the 1st batch - best believe I change at least one of the variables ... like the felt wad back to the LDPE.
  
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #7 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 9:45pm
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John Boy,
Here's the 37579 version I was wondering if you had tried out. OAL in this 325 grainer runs at 1.175 inches.
BP
  

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John Boy
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #8 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 10:36pm
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BP .. no, Sir.  But is sure is a kissing cousin to the 375166.  The OAL is the only difference ... 0.025" shorter.  Wonder why the Ideal 37579 in the Ideal/Lyman chart shows 3 GG's and your mold is 6.  Interesting!

Have you shot rounds from your mold?
  
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #9 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 11:49pm
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My older copy of the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook shows that the 37579 was available in seven weights from 135 gr. up to 325, the only differences being the number of grease grooves, based on how deep the cherry was positioned in the mold blocks.  That was a very common practice for many of their older bullet designs.

David
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David Kaiser
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John Boy
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #10 - Jul 15th, 2009 at 11:56pm
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David, you are right!  I totally failed to put 2 and 2 together when I looked at a Ideal/Lyman chart that's on the Internet instead of having to go to my old Ideal handbooks
Here's the link ... (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
  
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #11 - Jul 16th, 2009 at 8:20am
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John Boy, you probably have already come to this conclusion, but just in case somebody is coming late to the Ideal/Lyman show, there were certain of the Ideal designs in a series called the "Perfection" moulds.  they were all nose pour with a movable base plug to lengthen or shorten the bullet by a specified amount (based on the number of grease grooves.)  Some of these designs survived as single weight, base pour moulds as well.  This is possibly what we are seeing here, especially in view of the low number.  BTW, if somebody would reintroduce those old Perfection moulds, I bet they would be brisk sellers!!  I've got an old .25 and .32, but would love to own one in .38 and another in .45.  Roll Eyes

Froggie
  
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #12 - Jul 16th, 2009 at 6:37pm
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Froggie,
PM sent (I think?!?)
  

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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #13 - Jan 1st, 2015 at 10:53pm
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1:18 is mentioned.   Anyone shooting this in a 1:15 twist?   

I was considering a Hoch nose pour but have several Accurate molds I like quite a bit.

  

Best Regards,
John
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Re: Maiden Range Test: 38-55 Ideal 375166 Remake
Reply #14 - Jan 2nd, 2015 at 9:58am
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SgtDog, I don't have this bullet but do have a tapered Hoch mold, I think available from CPA, that is very similar. I have not shot it much and not on paper but with 45gr of Ctg black powder I was able to keep 10 out of 10 on the pigs at 300M in a 15" twist Badger barrel on a CPA 44 1/2. I am thinking that it may shoot a bit better with a little more powder in the case. The bullet was shot as cast and pan lubed. More work is needed once warm weather returns come March or April.
Sam
  
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