Good old California, where I live, has decided that Federal law saying all firearms must be shipped to a dealer in interstate exchange, is NOT GOOD ENOUGH..

Now, anyone desiring to ship a firearms INTO California must apply to the California DOJ (via a web page) for an "import permit", and all firearms must not only be shipped TO a dealer, but also must be shipped FROM a dealer.

So, many dealers, and non-dealer sellers, have said "screw that", and chosen to abandon residents of california.

I can't say I blame them, really... but it ticks me off because that's EXACTLY what our retarded legislators had in mind when they passed that law (very quietly.. .with no floor debate).
You want to piss off California legislators?  Keep right on jumping through their hoops, and shipping guns into the state...

Paul F.

I am a resident of the people's socialist state of California also.
If you check the Justice department web site and really read what the new law states you will see that they at least exempted antique firearms and they were smart, they used the Federal guidlines and they even mention them. Any firearm made before 1898 is exempt. Some of our gun stores in this state were pushing for  registration on the antique guns, one fruit loop gun dealer here said that a criminal could use a black powder colt revolver to comit a crime . I replied well I prefer my Loiusville Slugger, try and run a ballistics test on it. 
Our little town is so sad that my son got stopped by our local PD and they wanted to know why the bat and glove in the car-duu- he was in his base ball uniform too. Guess they never played ball as kids.
It is a wierd experience living here and hell I was born here.
MikeW

If you read the DOJ's web, you'll see that you don't need A NUMBER TO ship to a FFL if you're not a dealer.All the dealers are trying to do is hog all the business, it was there Law, we were sold out by the NRA, who NEVER opposes anything a dealer wants. That's not the real reason why some dealers hate CA, they just hate CA on general priniples,however why not HATE NY< CT , And MASS>There gun laws are far worse than ours.I'd  never live there.

singleshotman,
In what way are the NY gun laws "far worse" than CA's?

You're talking about New York City, not New York State; a common misunderstanding.

Hi Boats,
I am a little confused about this, doe's this mean you cannot personally take a firearm into California if you bought it in another state.
Regards.

Hey, the dealers in Ca. are just as nutty as the legislature! I tried to purchase a 1889 Marlin from a Ca. dealer at the Reno gun show, and he said he couldn't sell it to anyone who wasn't an FFL holder! The last 1889 Marlin built was around 1894, and I told him so. He said he didn't care if it was an antique or modern, he still wouldn't sell to the general public.
So it's not just dealers from other states that are confused or stupid.

Paul F.

At the risk of starting a feud (we live so close that you can probably hit my house from yours with a good buffalo gun), I must respectfully state that part of the confusion that exists is because people who don't know the law may try to understand it from reading inaccurate posts like the ones you have put in this thread.  Although I don't much like the new law either, I got a much different slant on it than you did when I read the DOJ web page.  

First of all, it only applies to persons with a federal firearms license, except for Type 3 (Curios & Relics) and Type 6 (Ammunition), which are exempted.  In addition, a person who does not have a FFL is not required to go through the process under the new law, but guns must be shipped into California through a FFL like they were before.  

Firearms which meet the federal definition of "antique" are not considered firearms, so they are not included under the new law.  And if C&R FFLs are exempted, then firearms which meet the federal definition of "curio & relic" (manufactured between January 1, 1899 and 50 years ago today and/or are on the federal C&R list) are also exempted from the new law.  So the law basically applies to transactions where a person with a FFL in another state wants to sell a modern firearm in California.

I have noticed over the years that some FFLs do not want to do business with Californians as a matter of business practice.  This is most likely a result of not wanting to take the time to learn what the law is, as it applies to Californians, or perhaps just simply because they have just written us off because we "allowed" the state legislature to pass the stupid laws to begin with, so they are "teaching us a lesson."  Whatever the reason, they are passing up a potential market that contains over 30 million people, so they must be making lots of money from buyers in all the other states (written somewhat tongue in cheek).

But there are also a surprising number of FFLs who will not do business with persons with a C&R FFL, either, on firearms which clearly qualify as C&R.  And also a large number of FFLs who will only ship antique firearms to another FFL, in spite of the fact that they are not even considered firearms under the law...and a large number who will only receive a shipped firearm through another FFL.

I think the big problem is that representatives of the regulatory agencies that hold the power over FFL dealers have put so much fear into them that they are making up their own rules, just trying to be on the safe side.  I can't really say that I blame them, but some of them take it to ridiculous extremes.  

So the latest round of "We do not ship to California" that you see in the ads on the auction sites could be partly caused by the same paranoia which makes people make up their own rules when they don't bother to take the time to understand the law; and partly caused by a fierce independence that dictates a preference for making less profit over bowing down to a legislature in another state that wants you jump through hoops and get their permission to do a perfectly legitimate gun deal in that state.  Perhaps both.

used to live in californikate, 
instead of airing this issue here why are y'all not running a flag pole up your legislatures asses and voting people into office that are not so anti firearm.
start raising @#$% send letters call make there lives as miserable as you can
irish

Paul F.

OK, how does this quote from the FAQs page on the California DOJ web site sound?  

"2.  I am not an FFL but I want to ship a firearm to a California FFL. Do I have to obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval number before shipping a firearm to California?
 
No. The requirement to obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval number only applies to holders of valid FFLs."

This is from (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Quote:



I don't recall disagreeing with you on how dealers and other SHOULD be treating Antiques.. In fact, I haven't mentioned antiques yet in my discussions about the new law. They're not affected, except by how some ignorant dealers treat them (and have always treated them... that's not new...)
I was confused on your referencing the Reno gun show and california in your tale about an idiot dealer...
Yes, antiques are bought and sold and shipped all the time, perfectly legally.
And there are dealers at the Reno Gun Show that WILL NOT sell to California residents.. (not specifically antiques). 
A local guy was snubbed by a Nevada dealer when he was trying to buy a hunting type rifle at the Reno Gun Show last year... so not every dealer there is there to supply Californians.

Paul F.

Sez the guy who has had more handles than I have socks..   


Paul F.

Ugly things, like "bolt action"?  Or "semi-auto"?




Paul F.

Marlinguy hit the nail on the head. Anyone including me that lives here in California is stuck. We need to educate moer folks to vote out the bums in office now. I'm 57 and as a kid this was an amazing state to grow up in, no crime, good hunting and good fishing and then came the darned LIBERALS. They have infiltrated everything to mold it there way. 
I buy and sell antique guns all the time and most of the time I have no problem to really speak of. Unless I get a real bad dealer or auctioner. The FEDS have scared a few gun store owners and auctioners near to death with the threats of closing up there place of buisness. One auctioner in Maine explained to me about six months ago that a FEDERAL AGENT team had hit every gun store in Maine and threatened them with closure unless they played ball. What the FEDS wanted was that even if the guns were made prior to 1898 if you could use modern ammo in it they considered it a FIREARM no matter what. Now, maybe this is what is causing the problem. Our FEDS could be up to no good again. I have a problem when they start re-writing laws for the hell of it.
MikeW

It's sad that someone will not sell guns to a californai location. Any non dealer can sell and send it toa FFL located here in Calif with no problems at all. If you are a FFL holder in another state then you need the Department of Justice OK for the transfer. Anyone can still do buisness the old way if they are not a FFL holder. 
I'm sue the new law will not last long. They are already trying to get it removed as it violated free trade between states. Hell, you sell cars and trucks with less hassle.

I am NOT an Obama supporter, and my local FFL dealer who I use will not ship to California.... he's the only one within a reasonable distance  as I'm out in the boonies. I am not a dealer,was unaware I could ship to Cal. without an FFL , and this was the first gun of any type I've ever SOLD out of state. Didn't know you had to be a " Philadelphia lawyer" to deal with sales in California . Boot your politicians out if your unhappy with them !!!!