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waterman
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.22 Short RF?
Jun 16th, 2008 at 12:18pm
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Is anyone shooting an original SS in .22 Short these days?  If so, what ammunition are you using?  What results are you getting?  And at what range?   

I've been messing about with a couple of Winders and a Winchester 74 gallery rifle off the bench for a couple of years.  The results are less than marvelous and seem to be more dismal with newer ammo.
  
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GCurtis
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #1 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 1:04pm
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I have been shooting a commercial Winder made in 1918 for about a year now. It has a strong preferance for the Aguila High Velocity 22 shorts. It does not like the CCI stuff in all the various configurations. This Winder will hit an 18 inch 200 yard gong regularly with the Aguila ammo. This ammo has got some zip to it, over 1000 FPS if I remember right.

I also have a Remmington model 12 or 24 (can't remember which off the top of my head) that is the JM Browning designed takedown semiauto gallery gun in 22 short. It does like the CCI stuff.

I guess each gun wants what it likes.
  
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Schutzenbob
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #2 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 1:09pm
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Mr. Waterman,

I've had very good luck with the CCI 22 Short ammo at 50 and 75 feet, I like shooting gallery and 22 Short is an extreamly accurate caliber at short ranges. All the old Zettler Brothers records were set with a 22 Short at 75 feet, at the turn of the last century offhand gallery shooting was big business and it's still a good way to improve your offhand ability. 

Bob
  
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Paul_F.
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #3 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 2:19pm
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Hi Waterman...

After you mentioned your .22 Short testing at the range, I was thinking... (normally dangerous...).
I think most of the "good" .22 Short ammo is used in some of the Olympic Pistol sports... and sadly, this sport is essentially extinct in North America save a bare few souls.

Perhaps looking at what they're shooting might lead you to a source for more/different brands of ammo to test?

Paul F.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #4 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 7:12pm
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I shoot an original Winchester Low Wall chambered for .22 short, and also a Ballard schuetzen rifle that was rebarreled with a Winchester .22 short barrel. Both are being fired with CCI CB Short sub sonic .22 Short ammo. 
Oviously I don't shoot 100 yds. with this ammo, but at 50 ft. indoor ranges it does perform really well. I have used it outdoors at 50 yds. and it does well at that distance too.
  
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #5 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 7:45pm
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Not quite an original,but I'm shooting a roller in 38-55 with a Lee Shaver insert in .22 short.Fiocci Super Match shorts shoot head and shoulders better than anything else,including new and old production American shorts in both std. and Hi-Velosity.Also tried Euro-Olympic shorts from Biakal and RWS.Best of all the Fiocci shorts are readily available from Graf.On my 25ft.indoor the only shots outside a ragged hole are your last twitch.
  
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Shooter_1
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #6 - Jun 16th, 2008 at 8:00pm
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Paul F.,
Your correct, most of the "good" Match Grade 22 Short Ammo is/was used by the 
Olympic Rapid Fire Pistol Shooters. 

Your also correct in that most of us old time washed up Olympic Pistol Shooters are just about extinct,  however I still have my Rapid Fire Pistol, and more than a few thousand rounds of 22 Short Match ammo, have Eley Green Box Rapid Fire Match, RWS  Red Box R-25 Match, and a bunch of Fiocchi Gold Box Match and Black Box Practice. All of this ammo is extremely accurate at 25 yards/meters  in a good handgun such as my Hammerli Model 232.  I often wondered how good the ammo would shoot in a good Rifle chambered and rifled for 22 Shorts, I did try some in a long rifle chamber just for kicks but of course the rifling twist was wrong and it didn't work out to well.

I can no longer shoot the Handgun events and don't have a Rifle to shoot shorts so I guess one of these days the ammo and gun will have to go.
   Shooter
  
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tim_s
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #7 - Jun 17th, 2008 at 10:26am
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I've been playing with a HB early Walnut Hill in a short with a Stevens 4x scope-no sights. This is a long octagonanl to round 1" @ the muzzle piece. Pretty heavy. I decided I really wanted to see how this thing would shoot it's best so I called Neill Stepp and ended up with a few bricks of the ELEY match. @ 25yds. from rest they will pretty much burn a little round hole and this is from a barrel that is only good not great, having seen a fair amount of black powder shorts. At the time there were also RWS shorts which I've heard good things about but the ELEY really exceeded anything I would have guessed.
  

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SPG
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #8 - Jun 17th, 2008 at 10:42am
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Gentlemen,

I have been using a Maynard Gallery rifle in .22 Short for several years for a "varmint" rifle around the homestead. I shoot the CCI High Vel Hollowpoints and can assure you that it will kill a feral tomcat out to 50 yards much cleaner than any of the .22 Long Rifles I've used. I've noticed the same thing on gophers and 'chucks...I don't know exactly why, but I think that the short hollowpoint bullet goes unstable as soon as it hits anything. The bullet will not completely penetrate even the small ground squirrels...just rolls them over dead. Keith Kilby and I did a gopher hunt down around Encampment and we both noticed the same thing concerning the killing effect of the .22 Short. I like the round and intend to make up a new rifle for the cartridge.

I think that too many people don't consider the .22 Short adequate for anything but they are selling the little cartridge "short". 

Sorry about that...

Steve
  
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tim_s
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #9 - Jun 17th, 2008 at 11:03am
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Quote:
Gentlemen,

I have been using a Maynard Gallery rifle in .22 Short for several years for a "varmint" rifle around the homestead. I shoot the CCI High Vel Hollowpoints and can assure you that it will kill a feral tomcat out to 50 yards much cleaner than any of the .22 Long Rifles I've used. I've noticed the same thing on gophers and 'chucks...I don't know exactly why, but I think that the short hollowpoint bullet goes unstable as soon as it hits anything. The bullet will not completely penetrate even the small ground squirrels...just rolls them over dead. Keith Kilby and I did a gopher hunt down around Encampment and we both noticed the same thing concerning the killing effect of the .22 Short. I like the round and intend to make up a new rifle for the cartridge.

I think that too many people don't consider the .22 Short adequate for anything but they are selling the little cartridge "short". 

Sorry about that...

Steve

You're absolutely right in that regard. Ive always loved the short for a rodent gun as well, to the point where I looked for about 10 years before I found a nice Belgian Browning auto from the early 60's in a short. Not a single shot but great fun none the less.
  

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marlinguy
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #10 - Jun 17th, 2008 at 7:22pm
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Hi Waterman...

After you mentioned your .22 Short testing at the range, I was thinking... (normally dangerous...).
I think most of the "good" .22 Short ammo is used in some of the Olympic Pistol sports... and sadly, this sport is essentially extinct in North America save a bare few souls.

Perhaps looking at what they're shooting might lead you to a source for more/different brands of ammo to test?

Paul F.


Don't tell anyone, but we still shoot Bullseye pistol matches in a fall league every year. Seems to still be hanging on here in the Pacific NW. I stopped due to bad shoulders, but there are a lot of clubs in the Willamette Valley that still compete together.-Vall
  
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Paul_F.
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #11 - Jun 17th, 2008 at 11:57pm
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We have a couple Bullseye matches at our club this year too... I bullied another guy into running 'em so I could shoot them this year.
But USA Shooting rules single shot pistol matches?  I doubt you'd find 3 clubs west of the Rockies holding more than one a year.

Darn shame too... I'd love to have an excuse to buy one of those psuedo-martini actioned Hammerli Free Pistols!  A guy in my club just bought one, and I'm SOO jelous!  (I also SOOOOO cannot afford one, LOL!).

Paul F.
  
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waterman
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #12 - Jun 18th, 2008 at 1:44am
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What constitutes a reasonable test of several different kinds of .22 short ammo?  I tried shooting the CCI Target stuff at 100 yards off the bench & sandbags, but I could use a yardstick to measure group size.   

In times past, they used to shoot the .22 Short at 100 & even 200 yards.  And those were BP and Lesmok loads.  But maybe with 40 grain bullets.
  
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tim_s
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Re: .22 Short RF?
Reply #13 - Jun 18th, 2008 at 8:41am
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Well, I've always been of the opinion that shorts were the gallery round of choice, ala Zeittler brothers NYC matches. The US version of Zimmerschutzen. IMHO 25 yards tells you everything you'd ever need to know.
  

“ I don’t have to be faster than the bear, I just have to be faster than you”
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