J.D. Steele,

I have attached a picture of two .44-40 and two 44 Mag cases with their heads sectioned. Starting from the left they are: 
 
Federal Cartridge 44 Mag 
Winchester .44-40 
Winchester Western Super 44 Mag 
Remington-Peters .44-40 
 
There are differences in the head depths (a little less than 0.010" between the 44 Mag and .44-40) , but it's the web, not the head thickness that determines how much pressure - up to 10,000 PSI supposedly - a case contains. And there is only about 0.001" of difference in the webs of these four cases. 

MartiniBelgian,
 
In the "it could happen" game of  

Quote:
 
I beg to disagree. 
 
The loads I posted giving 21,000 PSI for for the .30/.44-40 case were 100% of case capacity. So no chance of "accidental" double charge. By the same token, if you want to suggest that "you always run the risk of someone trying to get to the limits of the case,"  (as you did), then what's good for the goose is good for the gander. I can charge the .30/.357 with a 95% of case capacity load of I4227 (a reasonable powder for this case) that will generate over 85,000 PSI behind a 180-grain bullet. Now as I said, I know little about the Cadet action, so if you tell me that you'd rather stand next to someone doing that and not next to me with a .30/44-40 case generating 21,000 PSI, you're safe from finding me trying to cozy up to ya.  

Again, no effort on my part to 'sway' anyone. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. When possible, I just like to keep comparisons to apples and apples, and reality instead of speculation.

Paul

MartiniBelgian wrote on Mar 19^th, 2008 at 3:25am:


Great minds must think alike! You gents know more about the Cadet action than I, by far. This a subject (and proposed scenario) I have mulled over regarding more than one SS action. There are pressure limits, barrel tenon size, etc to be considered but within those parameters, using a bigger "combustion chamber" to reach a given velocity level generally allows use of slower burning powders resulting in loweer pressures. A max load of slow pistol powder in a.357 Max puts pressure at around 50K. If I can get the same results at lower pressure, I will take it.

I understand and reespect what you all are saying about not knowing what the next guy will do with a rifle. ANY gun/cartridge can be turned into a bomb. I am reminded of what the late Bill Ruger said when asked if his guns were foolproof (in terms of safety). His reply? "There is no proof against fools!" I have bit (?) of a tendency to be judgemental and opinionated but I think of Ruger's words in relation to a gent on another forum talking of seeing a Savage 110 bolt action blown up with 4227 lead bullet loads. ???   

GREAT DISCUSSION guys! 

J.D. Steele,

Quote:


Ditto! I couldn't be more in agreement.

Quote:


Agan, ditto. My experience as well. Although I don't lament the thin walls of the .44-40 when I'm trying to "shape things".

Quote:


The W-W Super 44 Mag web thickness at the junction of web and head was 0.027".
Mouth wall thickness - 0.012"

The F C 44 Mag web thickness at the junction of web and head was 0.029".
Mouth wall thickness - 0.014"

The R-P .44-40 WCF web thickness at the junction of web and head was 0.027".
Mouth wall thickness - 0.0075"

The Winchester .44-40 WCF web thickness at the junciton of web and head was 0.024".
Mouth wall thickness  - 0.0065"

All measured with a J. T. Slocomb Co., 0-1" tube micrometer with a post radius of 0.0625".

Oh yeah... I also suspect that the materials used are not necessarily the same. Most of us have come across "soft" brass. I've always wondered if the 44 Mag brass wasn't a bit harder than other pistol brass, and in this case the .44-40's. I don't have a hardness measurer that would be appropriate for brass. Maybe someone here at ASSRA does.

Quote:

Bingo! Right on Bill Ruger.

I choose not to constrain my life by worrying about what might happen if "someone else", "sometime" in the future, chooses to do something stupid. There are a world full of lawyers and politicians that do more than enough of that 'worrying' for all of us.

Sounds like the consensus here is the .30 Herret. A good choice.

Paul

Greetings all. Been following this martini thread regarding a proper cast bullet cartridge. Tried looking in a few reference books but cannot lind anything about the 30-30 wesson. What cartridge case is the parent brass, how hard is the conversion process and are there reamers, dies, load data. And last but not least barrel twist?. Thanks for your help, Regards Frank

Hi
Most of my information on this ctg. came from this group a couple of years ago when i went through a similiar project. the dies came from C&H, the reamer came from Pacific tool 331 neck dia.. Action from Chad Scott and the barrel 308 Remington tactical 12 twist from a shootingt friend who wanted another caliber. The Remington varmint weight barrels are just the right contour for the small Martini action. Project cost less than $350 and shoots most good cast bullets into less than 1 inch. The barrel had not had a jacketed bullet through it with the previous owner. I got real lucky with this one. Brass 357 Maximum from midway.
I also have a Uberti HW in 30/30 win. which is not particular about which bullet it is shooting. with 12 twist and when loaded around 1600fps
lots of luck Tom

FRANK
I THINK ALL THE REMINGTON 308 BARRELS ARE 12 TWIST FOR THE VARMINT, THE TACTICAAL AND THE 40X. IT WAS RUMORED THE VARMINT WAS A 40X THAT DIDNT PASS INSPECT.THEY SEEM TO HAVE THE SAME CONTOUR. YOU CAN CUT AT THE CHAMBER AND STILL HAVE ENOUGH BARREL. MINE FINISHED AT 23". WATCH EBAY. I KEPT THE REAMER MIGHT DO A PISTOL IF I FIND A RUGER 30 CARBINE
LOTS OF LUCK ITS WORTH THE EFFORT.
TOM

Frank
Save yourselfe future agrivation and bush the firingpin hole early in the project. Also Snaps in Michigan is a Martini goldmine of information.
Tom