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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Frame or Block Hung Hammer ?? (Read 11960 times)
Tentman
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Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Aug 30th, 2006 at 11:21pm
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Hello Guys

What think you all on the relative advantages and disadvantages of hammers that are hung on the block and travel (like a 'Wall), versus those that are hung on the frame (like a CPA) ??

Which works best for target work, which for hunting ??
Does one have an advantage in getting a good stock configuration ?
Is one better with a scope ??

Any other issues (triggers, geometry, plain ol' personal preference) ??

Cheers - Foster

PS I have the J Grant books to hand, what a wonderful resource.
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #1 - Aug 31st, 2006 at 7:42am
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I think it's pretty clear that either way works quite well.
Brent
  
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MartiniBelgian
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #2 - Aug 31st, 2006 at 8:47am
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Personally, I prefer to eliminate that specific part - no hammer is much better!  one hard choice less, too  Roll Eyes
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #3 - Aug 31st, 2006 at 9:09am
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You Martini folks - Give your thumb a job, keep it off the streets and out of trouble - it will greatly appreciate the chance to prove its worth.   Smiley Smiley

Know anyone that wants a fancy old Martini sporter .577-450.  My thumb just isn't happy with nothing to do.   

Brent
  
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Paul_F.
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #4 - Aug 31st, 2006 at 11:24am
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Quote:

Know anyone that wants a fancy old Martini sporter .577-450.  My thumb just isn't happy with nothing to do.   

Brent


(ears perk up)
Sure!   

Wink

Paul F.
  
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harry_eales
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #5 - Sep 1st, 2006 at 2:25am
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You Martini folks - Give your thumb a job, keep it off the streets and out of trouble - it will greatly appreciate the chance to prove its worth.   Smiley Smiley

Know anyone that wants a fancy old Martini sporter .577-450.  My thumb just isn't happy with nothing to do.  

Brent


Errmmm, Brent.

Whats your thumb going to be doing when you fire that Borchardt your working on? Hmm.  Smiley

Harry.
  
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MartiniBelgian
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #6 - Sep 1st, 2006 at 3:36am
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Harry,

That's why people have noses....   Wink
  
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gwahir
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #7 - Sep 2nd, 2006 at 8:55pm
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A block hung hammer does a better job of getting out of the way for loading and ejection and does not require an angled firingpin. Only the ballard and the winchester had block hung hammers on this side of the water although the Germans used them with internal hammers. I can think of no disadvantages to the block hung system.
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #8 - Sep 2nd, 2006 at 10:20pm
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Harry,
I haven't shot the Borchardt yet, but this is a serious issue that I'm loosing a lot of sleep over.

Tomorrow morning there may be a window in the weather.  I'm loaded and ready.

Brent
  
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harry_eales
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #9 - Sep 3rd, 2006 at 6:02am
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Harry,
I haven't shot the Borchardt yet, but this is a serious issue that I'm loosing a lot of sleep over.

Tomorrow morning there may be a window in the weather.  I'm loaded and ready.

Brent


Hello Brent,
I hope the weather held and you had a good day. However, If owning and shooting a Borchardt continues affecting your health, I'll take it off your hands. Hell, I'll even pay the shipping costs.  Grin  Grin  Grin

Harry
  
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Dale53
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #10 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 12:27am
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Harry;
I appreciate a man with heart! Roll Eyes

Dale53
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #11 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 8:00am
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Harry, after shooting yesterday, it's apparent that the rifle is going to be more than competitive so my thumb is just going to have to live with it, and I'm afraid you will have to live without it.   

However, I will give a princely sum to anyone that can come up with a good trigger for the beast, Canjar or otherwise.

Brent
  
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harry_eales
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #12 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 10:58am
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Harry, after shooting yesterday, it's apparent that the rifle is going to be more than competitive so my thumb is just going to have to live with it, and I'm afraid you will have to live without it.  

However, I will give a princely sum to anyone that can come up with a good trigger for the beast, Canjar or otherwise.
Brent


That's a done deal Brent, you have an Email with attachments. I claim the prize.  Grin

Harry
  
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MartiniBelgian
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #13 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 12:24pm
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Harry, remind me not to challenge you...  Although I don't really believe Brent will go for the Zischang double set.
  
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hst
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #14 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 3:24pm
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Gentlemen:

I sure would go for the Zischang double set, but I must comfess that the best  I could come up with is a Jesterly Fortune  Does someone have working drawings?

Glenn
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #15 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 9:40pm
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Glenn, I'd love the Zischang triggers if only they existed.  Who the heck is Jesterly Fortune.

Brent
  
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gwahir
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #16 - Sep 4th, 2006 at 11:28pm
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Might have been an interesting discussion if the origional question had been addressed!!
  
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40_Rod
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #17 - Sep 5th, 2006 at 8:58am
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I think that frontier armory has a casting kit for the Zischang triggers. Argus Barker will convert a Borchardt to double sets in the Zischang style. Be aware that the wait time may be excesive with Argus.

40 Rod
  
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Brent
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #18 - Sep 5th, 2006 at 9:09am
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40,
Do you have an email or website or phone for Frontier?

Thanks,
Brent
  
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harry_eales
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #19 - Sep 5th, 2006 at 10:50pm
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40,
Do you have an email or website or phone for Frontier?

Thanks,
Brent


Hello Brent, perhaps I can help. See:- (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Wes Stanley is difficult to contact I understand and slow in replying to Emails. I'm still waiting for him to reply to mine from 6 months ago. Best perhaps to ring him.

Harry
  
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drc
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #20 - Sep 21st, 2006 at 8:00am
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Glenn,

"These complete Model 1878 Sharps Borchardt Machinist Drawings have all the detail it takes to make a complete rifle or just that part your rifle is missing. Drawings for the Zischang double set triggers are also included. All the angles and radii, measurements, screw threads etc. These would also make interesting framed conversation pieces to decorate your loading room. These complete drawings are large blue print size pages. "

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dave
  
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harry_eales
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Re: Frame or Block Hung Hammer ??
Reply #21 - Sep 21st, 2006 at 6:24pm
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drc wrote on Sep 21st, 2006 at 8:00am:
Glenn,

"These complete Model 1878 Sharps Borchardt Machinist Drawings have all the detail it takes to make a complete rifle or just that part your rifle is missing. Drawings for the Zischang double set triggers are also included. All the angles and radii, measurements, screw threads etc. These would also make interesting framed conversation pieces to decorate your loading room. These complete drawings are large blue print size pages. "

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

dave


If these plans are the same set that were drawn in 2000 by the Moeller Machine and tool Co., then it isn't possible to build a Borchardt action or either the Zischchang or Zika DST's from them alone. A lot of dimensions are missing, some are incorrect, and some can only be deduced by consulting several of the drawings and doing some calculations. 

I have the Moeller Borchardt Drawings (7 in all) each roughly 3'x2' A whole page is devoted to each of the DST's. As you may have seen elsewhere on this 'Board' I am building a copy of this rifle action. 

If it were not for the help of some very generous friends who have supplied me with dimensions taken from their own rifles and supplied a copious number of photographs, my project would have ground to a halt weeks ago.

I cannot comment on the plans offered by Buffalo Arms as I haven't seen them, and as far as I am aware no reader of this 'Board' has. I wish someone had, we could compare notes, to see if in fact they are one and the same.

The ASSRA Archive have 'sketch drawings' of both DST's for US$ 3.00 that provide exactly the same dimension information. But as I mentioned above many measurements are missing. 

Harry

  
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