ASSRA Forum - Nose pour mold troubles

ASSRA Forum › General › General Discussion › Nose pour mold troubles

(Moderator Group: Moderator)

‹ Previous Topic | Next Topic ›

Page Index Toggle

Pages: [1]

Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies)

Nose pour mold troubles (Read 1065 times)

cellargun Junior Member Offline Posts: 71 Joined: Feb 28^th, 2022	Nose pour mold troubles Oct 1^st, 2025 at 5:39pm	Print Post
	I've had a Hoch nose pour 38/55 mold for nearly 20 years. A random conversation with a friend made me think of it and get it from the depths of my safe. I fired up the Lyman melt pot last night, cast 3 dozen, had 5 that weren't total junk. Tried again today with various lead temps as the PID control on the Lyman makes it easy. 720, 750, 780, with only a few keepers. If the base is flat, the bands are rounded, or only rounded on one side of the mold. If the bands are decent, the base isn't good, or the nose is bad, or combinations of all the above. Now I remember why it's been forgotten in the safe. The lead is 1/20 certified alloy that casts very well for other, albeit smaller, bullets. I heated the mold on the pot rim, tried more heat with a propane torch, all to no avail. Faster pour rate, slower pour rate, the mold tight against the spout, still issues. I even tried pouring some with a ladle with the same less than stellar results. I'm stumped. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks.


	IP Logged

Jeff_Schultz ASSRA Board Member Offline Posts: 1643 Location: Ransomville, NY Joined: Apr 25^th, 2004	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #1 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 6:15pm	Print Post
	Get your alloy up to around 850 and your problems will be gone.

	"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo “There is no situation so bad that it cannot be made worse." Confidence- The feeling you get before you fully understand the situation.
	IP Logged

gunlaker Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2428 Location: lower mainland, B.C. Joined: Dec 13^th, 2010	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #2 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 6:19pm	Print Post
	My Hoch nose pour mold want to be hot and run very fast. I basically set the pot to 850 and cast as quickly as I can. Once the mold starts to fill out fully the bullets will come out with incredible consistency in fill out and weight. Chris.


	IP Logged

cellargun Junior Member Offline Posts: 71 Joined: Feb 28^th, 2022	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #3 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 7:52pm	Print Post
	Jeff and Gunlaker- thanks. Getting the same answer from 2 different people sounds like I need to try a lot more heat. Not that I suppose it matters, but does it result in frosted bullets?


	IP Logged

Jeff_Schultz ASSRA Board Member Offline Posts: 1643 Location: Ransomville, NY Joined: Apr 25^th, 2004	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #4 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 8:02pm	Print Post
	No.

	"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo “There is no situation so bad that it cannot be made worse." Confidence- The feeling you get before you fully understand the situation.
	IP Logged

gnoahhh Oldtimer Offline Posts: 980 Location: Gaithersburg, MD Joined: Mar 31^st, 2010	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #5 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 8:53pm	Print Post
	And if the bullets are a bit frosty, macht nichts.


	IP Logged

Bent_Ramrod Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1532 Location: Southern Arizona Joined: Feb 8^th, 2006	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #6 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 9:53pm	Print Post
	There's a lot of machinery on the Hoch nose-pour moulds and it all has to get up to temperature. The handles have a lot of metal in them and the base-and-sprue plate sheds a lot of heat when it is swung out, as well. Getting the temperature up should do it. I've found that some moulds just need more or less use time before they finally start producing. A couple-three less-than-satisfactory sessions and then the block metal seems to "season" (or something) and then it starts producing "keepers.".


	IP Logged

cellargun Junior Member Offline Posts: 71 Joined: Feb 28^th, 2022	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #7 - Oct 1^st, 2025 at 10:04pm	Print Post
	gunlaker wrote on Oct 1^st, 2025 at 6:19pm: My Hoch nose pour mold want to be hot and run very fast. I basically set the pot to 850 and cast as quickly as I can. Once the mold starts to fill out fully the bullets will come out with incredible consistency in fill out and weight. Chris. I fired up my Lyman PID pot after supper and learned it maxes out at 840. I figured close enough, let it stabilize, and got to work. While I didn't get 100% good bullets, I got a lot more than when I was using cooler alloy. The culls all had fill out issues on the bands, but the other issues more or less went away till the pot was half empty. Maybe not enough weight to keep up a good flow? The bullets won't drop free from the mold and require multiple raps on the handle pivot to get them to drop free which doesn't do much for a consistent casting pace. I'll weigh the bullets tomorrow to see if they are even close to one another.


	IP Logged

RSW Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1261 Location: Arizona Joined: Sep 8^th, 2006	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #8 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 12:34am	Print Post
	cellergun Just my opinion but I think your main issue is a bottom pour lead pot. I gave up trying to cast match quality rifle bullets with at bottom pour over 40 years ago. You might try casting with a ladle, you can use your bottom pour pot with a ladle and I'll bet the quality of your bullets takes a huge change for the better. As a parting comment, try the Lyman ladle, it's the best design out there.

	Randy W ASSRA 10211 - ISSA 125 There are indeed two Americas. Simply put, it is not the haves and have nots. The two Americans are in reality divided into those who do and those who don't.
	GTalk IP Logged

silver Full Member Offline Posts: 224 Location: Central wi, Joined: Sep 20^th, 2016	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #9 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 8:35am	Print Post
	Agree with all comments, I have 1 hoch mold and it needs To be casted hotter than the rest of the molds I have.


	IP Logged

gunlaker Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2428 Location: lower mainland, B.C. Joined: Dec 13^th, 2010	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #10 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 8:36am	Print Post
	I agree with RSW. That mold will work a lot better with a ladle. I hadn't realized that you are bottom pouring. Chris.


	IP Logged

cellargun Junior Member Offline Posts: 71 Joined: Feb 28^th, 2022	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #11 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 9:59am	Print Post
	RSW wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 12:34am: cellergun Just my opinion but I think your main issue is a bottom pour lead pot. I gave up trying to cast match quality rifle bullets with at bottom pour over 40 years ago. You might try casting with a ladle, you can use your bottom pour pot with a ladle and I'll bet the quality of your bullets takes a huge change for the better. As a parting comment, try the Lyman ladle, it's the best design out there. As stated, I tried ladle casting the other day but it was at a lower temp than the suggested 850. I have a dedicated ladle only pot with no pour mechanism and a Lyman ladle, so it's a matter of switching pots on the bench.


	IP Logged

Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Online Posts: 1184 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #12 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 10:36am	Print Post
	No one has mentioned making certain the mould is clean. This has bit me in the butt before, more than once and the first time was actually a Hoch nose pour. Holding medium heat to the cavity in the mold, more than a candle, low propane heat, watch for the surface to start to sweat. The heat will draw oil from the pores if it’s there. If that happens, it will be impossible to use a match or candle and have smoke stick to the area. If that happens lead won’t fill the cavity.


	IP Logged

1Hawkeye Full Member Offline Posts: 185 Location: South end of Northern Virginia Joined: Jun 29^th, 2019	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #13 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 11:24am	Print Post
	I have to agree with everyone else. I have 1 Hoch mold but wish for more. What I found works the best is to ladle pour with your lead and run the mold hot & clean. I know with my mold it takes around 25 to 30 casts to get up to temperature but when it hits the right temp they come out great. I'm casting a .459" 500gr round nose.


	IP Logged

cellargun Junior Member Offline Posts: 71 Joined: Feb 28^th, 2022	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #14 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 1:44pm	Print Post
	Ladle pour for the win. Thank you for all the suggestions. The mold has been scrubbed more than once with carb cleaner and most recently acetone, so it's definitely squeaky clean, with no sweating from the torch while warming it up. I fired up my dedicated ladle pot this morning, tried running it at 725 and had a 70% reject rate. Tossed those back in the pot, ran it up to 750, let it stabilize, fluxed and started casting. Why 725 and 750 instead of 850? I can get it hotter with more control than cooling it down and I'd rather cast cooler than hotter if possible to prevent alloy deterioration. I cast some bullets, have 42 that look great visually and a dozen culls. That's a reject rate of 20% which is more than I like, but better than the previous 70-90%. Some rejects were no doubt due to mold heat up, some were no doubt due to operator error while reestablishing my ladle technique and a casting rhythm. Hopefully the next session will be even better. Thanks again for everyone's help and suggestions. Richard


	IP Logged

gunlaker Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2428 Location: lower mainland, B.C. Joined: Dec 13^th, 2010	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #15 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 3:57pm	Print Post
	Once you get the mold hot enough, you should be able to get the reject rate down really low. The last batch of Hoch bullets I cast ( 322205, base pour not a nose pour though ) had the last 93 bullets come in from 208.0 to 208.2gr with no rejects. That mold also likes to be run hot at quickly, but not quite as much as my 322200D which is a nose pour. I also find that ambient temp in my casting shed has a pretty big effect. If it's anywhere near freezing out, I don't even bother with nose pour molds. It's interesting how different the little Hoch molds act compared to my Buffalo Arms molds which use heavy Saeco blocks. With those, depending on temperature, I wait 20-25 seconds after the sprue has frozen to drop the bullet. With the Hoch nose pour molds if I tried that I'd never get a single decent bullet because the mold cools so much faster. I'm glad your having some success. When I first used those molds I found them frustrating. Someone here recommended more heat and speed and suddenly these became my favorite molds to use. Chris.


	IP Logged

bpjack Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3339 Location: East Olympia, WA Joined: May 18^th, 2008	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #16 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 4:55pm	Print Post
	I have a few Hoch nose pour moulds and have never experienced these issues. I cast 20-1 at 820 degrees and smoke to cavities with birthday candles. I cast fairly quickly and cut the sprue as soon as it hardens. Jack

	ASSRA # 11318 There are more hydrogen atoms in a single molecule of water than there are suns in the entire solar system.
	IP Logged

bpjack Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3339 Location: East Olympia, WA Joined: May 18^th, 2008	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #17 - Oct 2^nd, 2025 at 7:56pm	Print Post
	I also pre heat on a hot plate.

	ASSRA # 11318 There are more hydrogen atoms in a single molecule of water than there are suns in the entire solar system.
	IP Logged

4570mike Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 430 Location: On the Peninsula Joined: Apr 11^th, 2013	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #18 - Oct 3^rd, 2025 at 5:26pm	Print Post
	I have a Hoch, .38 cal. Nose pour mold for my 38-55 CPA. Paul recommended it when I ordered the rifle several years ago. Unlike Lyman and other molds, it has more hardware to heat up before it yields good castings. Contrary to some comments here, I use a bottom pour Lyman casting furnace with much success. I think it requires techniques maybe a bit different than a ladle. Like some others, I preheat the mold on a hot plate. I make sure both the top and bottom plated are “hot”. When dropping the melt into the mold, I leave generous blob on top of the sprew plate to insure the nose gets well filled. I cast with 20:1 alloy and set the furnace temp to 800F. If the mold is preheated sufficiently, good castings usually begin to appear after several initial pours. Mike.


	IP Logged

Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4175 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #19 - Oct 3^rd, 2025 at 10:01pm	Print Post
	I ladle pour 20:1 alloy at 826 degrees to obtain the best quality bullets. I do not get frosted bullets. I adjust the time I hold the ladle on the mould to ensure enough weight of lead fully fills the mold but not too long that it starts to drive too much lead resulting in lead whiskers where the mold meets together. Ladle pouring always results in bullets with less weight variation compared to bottom pouring.


	IP Logged

westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11900 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #20 - Oct 3^rd, 2025 at 10:53pm	Print Post
	cellargun wrote on Oct 1^st, 2025 at 5:39pm: I've had a Hoch nose pour 38/55 mold for nearly 20 years. A random conversation with a friend made me think of it and get it from the depths of my safe. I fired up the Lyman melt pot last night, cast 3 dozen, had 5 that weren't total junk. Tried again today with various lead temps as the PID control on the Lyman makes it easy. 720, 750, 780, with only a few keepers. If the base is flat, the bands are rounded, or only rounded on one side of the mold. If the bands are decent, the base isn't good, or the nose is bad, or combinations of all the above. Now I remember why it's been forgotten in the safe. The lead is 1/20 certified alloy that casts very well for other, albeit smaller, bullets. I heated the mold on the pot rim, tried more heat with a propane torch, all to no avail. Faster pour rate, slower pour rate, the mold tight against the spout, still issues. I even tried pouring some with a ladle with the same less than stellar results. I'm stumped. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks. Think I have the same mold. Number 375-310? Had lots of trouble with mine. I fixed it but don't remember what I did. Works good now. Did that help? Probly not, sorry. Wait, ... , it's, it's, it's coming back to me.... The plates didn't fit the mold blocks tight enough. I shortened the spacer tube and vented the mold. I remember a lot of cussing and other bad language. It was a stubborn pain in the butt but I finally won. Perty sure it was a late production mold for CPA as it casts about .375-6. If it were mine I would look at venting and sprue hole size. Vent it at the nose end. A small bevel with a file across the edge of the mold is all that's needed. You gotta let the air out as the cavity fills with lead.
	« Last Edit: Oct 3^rd, 2025 at 11:06pm by westerner »
	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
	IP Logged

Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4175 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #21 - Oct 3^rd, 2025 at 11:24pm	Print Post
	Agreed I vent all my molds to ensure a sharp square base. Trapped air under the sprue plate reults in rounded base edges since not all the lead can perculate to fully fill the mold. Do not remove too much or you will end up with whiskers off the base of the bullet if the venting is too aggressive.


	IP Logged

Smoke Oldtimer Offline Posts: 785 Location: San Diego Joined: Feb 24^th, 2013	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #22 - Oct 4^th, 2025 at 1:43am	Print Post
	One thing I haven't seen mentioned above is how difficult it can be to get the base filled in properly. Someone, in another post, mentioned that it can be hard to get the base plate to retain heat. I have a .32 mold that I could not get the base to fill in properly. A friend made me a thicker base plate. It retains the heat better, problem solved.

	How do we know that humanity isn't just a race of tame primates, domesticated by dogs to serve their purposes?
	IP Logged

westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11900 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #23 - Oct 4^th, 2025 at 8:58am	Print Post
	Smoke wrote on Oct 4^th, 2025 at 1:43am: One thing I haven't seen mentioned above is how difficult it can be to get the base filled in properly. Someone, in another post, mentioned that it can be hard to get the base plate to retain heat. I have a .32 mold that I could not get the base to fill in properly. A friend made me a thicker base plate. It retains the heat better, problem solved. I have 15 Hoch nose pour molds and none have had a problem filling the base. Not a common problem?

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
	IP Logged

Smoke Oldtimer Offline Posts: 785 Location: San Diego Joined: Feb 24^th, 2013	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #24 - Oct 4^th, 2025 at 10:47am	Print Post
	westerner wrote on Oct 4^th, 2025 at 8:58am: I have 15 Hoch nose pour molds and none have had a problem filling the base. Not a common problem? Don't know. But it solved mine. The mold is .316" x 220 gr.

	How do we know that humanity isn't just a race of tame primates, domesticated by dogs to serve their purposes?
	IP Logged

Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4175 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #25 - Oct 6^th, 2025 at 12:00am	Print Post
	My Hoch mold was a bottom pour mould.


	IP Logged

Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4175 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Nose pour mold troubles Reply #26 - Oct 6^th, 2025 at 12:02am	Print Post
	My Hoch mold was a bottom pour mould I used when I first started Schuetzen but I then converted to only using Paul Jones moulds which had thicker sprue plates which retained heat better.


	IP Logged

Page Index Toggle

Pages: [1]

‹ Previous Topic | Next Topic ›

« Board Index ‹ Board Top

Top

ASSRA Forum » Powered by YaBB 2.6.12!
YaBB Forum Software © 2000-2025. All Rights Reserved.

Valid XHTML

Valid CSS

Powered by Perl

Source Forge

Page completed in 0.9556 seconds.