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Cat_Whisperer
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Cast bullet RUNOUT
Sep 25th, 2025 at 6:26pm
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Does anyone here make a practice (for matches) of measuring/sorting the bullets based on minimum runout?

If so, how do you measure it &, with that form of measurement, what range of runout do you find.

AND, how does that correlate to accuracy?

Military (7.62x51) match ammo is (as noted in the FM) about 2 or 3 thousandths.
  

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rifleman
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #1 - Sep 26th, 2025 at 2:45pm
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Doesn't your NECO have a second V Block for the case? If so, in my experience, without two V blocks on the case and the bullet ‘floating’ or unsupported, if there is runout, you dont know where it exists. 

With a bottle neck case, maybe its in the form of a banana from running your neck over and expander without enough lube stretching it crooked. In your picture you wouldnt know if  the runout was from the bullet seated crooked in a straight neck, or seated straight in a crooked case. 

I use a runout guage to check for issues with my setup and methods, then it gets shoved to the back of the bench. Just my experience.
  
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Cat_Whisperer
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #2 - Sep 26th, 2025 at 8:48pm
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(no I only have the one vblock)

Runout is a simple measurement.  Of course you allude to the important relationship of coaxiality - is the bullet's axis the same as that of the axis of the bore.   

We're making the assumption that if the simple runout is low that the coaxialiity is also good.

It incudes ALL the errors:  axis off center (perhaps from varying wall thickness), bent bullet, bullet not aligned axially with the case, et al.  (Not to mention the fit of the casing to the chamber.)

In the  picture you'll notice that the bullet is supported at its nose and the case down by the base.  IF the runout is minimal, that's good.
  

Cat Whisperer (trk)
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Cat_Whisperer
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #3 - Sep 26th, 2025 at 8:52pm
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So, the question remains.  Are there folks that use runout with CAST bullets?   

I've used the measurement of it to greatly improve the accuracy of my reloading 7.62 Nato for Army large bore competition using M14's.
  

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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #4 - Sep 27th, 2025 at 12:13pm
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Cat, I have been checking the run-out on all of my cast bullet loads in the 45-70 and 40-65 for silhouette shooting.  Sorry, but I haven't checked the difference in accuracy if not checked.  Just an anal thing with me.  I use a RCBS Case Master concentricity tool that supports the back of the case and the gauge runs on the ogive of the bullet like yours.  Any round that measures over .003" I will push in the opposite direction on the bench to straighten. Sometimes I get .005 " or a little more on my rounds, most likely due to case thickness or who knows.  Any rounds that cannot be straightened will become foulers. My silhouette rounds will measure 0-.002,3 " of runout .Boson
  
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Cat_Whisperer
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #5 - Sep 28th, 2025 at 10:38pm
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Boson wrote on Sep 27th, 2025 at 12:13pm:
Cat, I have been checking the run-out on all of my cast bullet loads in the 45-70 and 40-65 for silhouette shooting.  Sorry, but I haven't checked the difference in accuracy if not checked.  Just an anal thing with me.  I use a RCBS Case Master concentricity tool that supports the back of the case and the gauge runs on the ogive of the bullet like yours.  Any round that measures over .003" I will push in the opposite direction on the bench to straighten. Sometimes I get .005 " or a little more on my rounds, most likely due to case thickness or who knows.  Any rounds that cannot be straightened will become foulers. My silhouette rounds will measure 0-.002,3 " of runout .Boson


Coool!  Thanks.  I'd thought, of course, about sorting and having a limit for 'target' loads vs plinkers. BUT, I've questioned about the success for "straitening" bullets.  THANKS!
  

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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #6 - Sep 28th, 2025 at 11:40pm
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Any bullets exceeding .001 runout can affect accuracy.
The more the runout the more the accuracy may be affected.

I would only shoot bullets with a maximum of .002 runout in competitions.

To minimize runout I used the Shiloh inline seater for my .40-65.

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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #7 - Sep 29th, 2025 at 9:42am
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I tried looking at runout when I got into BPCR, but the mold I used left a very slight seam on the bullet where the halves mated. Almost couldn't feel it, but it threw my numbers off. When I stopped resizing the cases, and finger seating the bullet out further, the bullet wobbles around quite a bit, so the numbers do not apply.

I load my rounds slightly longer than the chamber and use a cam seater to get them the rest of the way. My thought is that will start the bullet square to the bore before firing
  
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #8 - Sep 29th, 2025 at 10:38am
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my attempts with shooting slightly long, loose-seated bullets always left me with the nagging notion that some slipped into the case further, while some did not. And to variable amounts. No way to tell for sure, but whether or not that was happening, it bothered me, and accuracy didn't get better- end of experiment.
  
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Re: Cast bullet RUNOUT
Reply #9 - Sep 29th, 2025 at 1:29pm
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So far this has been my best BPCR load, I'll be putting it on paper Wednesday, but I have always done great out to the pig range (joke is my shooting box is a pig pen because of all the 5&10 pins that are only on pigs), but beyond that, I am all over. We do shoot in a big, variable cross wind. Last match I crammed as much powder as I could in the 45-70 and got the most rams as I have in a couple years, and that was with no wind flags. 

83ge of Swiss 1.5 gets a 535gr bullet to 1300fps. Definitely can't test runout on these
  
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