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yamoon
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Old powder
Jun 20th, 2025 at 9:42pm
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I have a full pound of IMR4198 I bought in 1984, when I open the can there is still a strong solvent smell. What are your thoughts on using it?
Thanks Mike
  
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gnoahhh
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Re: Old powder
Reply #1 - Jun 20th, 2025 at 10:06pm
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Do what you will, but if it were mine I'd shoot it. I've used powder a lot older than that. What matters is if it's good, not if it's old.

I have the remains of the keg of WWII surplus 4831 that my Father bought circa 1968. It smells ok, no brown rust in the powder, and I load a couple '06's with it every few years for nostalgia reasons. How long it'll stay good is anybody's guess, but I'll continue to use it as long as it does.

On the other hand, two weeks ago I sprinkled a full pound of IMR4831 (that a buddy gave me a while back) on the grass because it had gone bad (the powder not the grass!) - unopened since it was made 20-30 years ago. Go figure. (Of course I can't attest to the conditions it was stored in before it came to me. All my powder lives in cool dry circumstances.) I cried because my 6.5x55 loves it and I can't find any for sale.

Edit: thought of another anecdote. 10-12 years ago I came into an old can of SR-80 (the fore runner of 4759) that had to date to the 1930's. Being inquisitive from having read a lot of stuff about reloading from before the War, I had to try it. It smelled ok, and shot quite well in a Springfield with cast bullets.
« Last Edit: Jun 20th, 2025 at 10:29pm by gnoahhh »  
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Timetripper
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Re: Old powder
Reply #2 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 9:29am
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The only way to tell is to load some up. 
After my father passed I inherited a couple of pounds of BlC2, "Ball C" as he called it. I know that they dated from the late 1960s and one was an opened, partial can. It all did good in my 222 Rem and 30-06 loads.

John
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Old powder
Reply #3 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 9:33am
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How old is not as important as how it's stored and temperature it's stored in. I also have old powder that's from WWII surplus that I still use and stored in my basement that's dry and cool it shoots great.
  

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craigster
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Re: Old powder
Reply #4 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 10:20am
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It will probably work just fine.
  
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Skalkaho
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Re: Old powder
Reply #5 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 11:29am
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I had a old can that when poured let off a yellow dust ! Strong smelling. I torched it!
  

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calledflyer
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Re: Old powder
Reply #6 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 11:35am
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pity sake, I have a can of DuPont #5 pistol powder that I shot just to see what it was like. Hardest part was finding my first source of load data for .45 Colt with a very heavy slug. 
I don't even know when they quit making that powder. Way back ago. Shoot yours, it's just seasoned not dead.
  
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burntwater
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Re: Old powder
Reply #7 - Jun 21st, 2025 at 3:35pm
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My opinion only. With gun powder availability and pricing I understand more reloaders reluctant to throw a can of old spoiled powder in the garden. But other than the smell if you find old powder turning reddish and rusting the can I personally would throw it out. When it turns reddish and acidic it's turned and may shoot but not as designed and made. 

Some powders like Winchester/Olin ball powders have a coating on the balls that retards the rate of ignition. This is specially formulated to make, what Olin called, a ' progressive burn ' which regulates the pressure curve down the barrel. During the process of ball powder deterioration this retardant coating decomposes first so the powder lites off faster than it should. This may create a serious pressure problems with hot loads. 

Stick powders, according to my old neighbor Frank Snow, ( founder of Sierra Bullets ), deteriorates faster because of increased surface area created by the hole in the middle of the kernels. During WWII the USN had problems with stick powders they stored at Subic Bay in the Philippines and had to dump tons of it due to deterioration and guns that were acting up. 

According to Frank Snow and others such as Homer Powley, ' Unique '  is probably the most environmentally stable of powders as it is pretty much water resistant. 

Rick
« Last Edit: Jun 21st, 2025 at 6:53pm by burntwater »  
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calledflyer
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Re: Old powder
Reply #8 - Jun 22nd, 2025 at 1:07pm
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I had not intended to send anyone out to shoot any old powder, regardless of age or condition. The can of #5 I shot was in perfect shape, dark, even and in a wholly unmarred can. 
The smell had vanished, if it ever had one. And, the first loads were shot in a Ruger, prior to loading some up for the Colt SA. 
I have shot old powders in other cases, just not a long-forgotten one like the above. I have some 2400 that was old when I got it, and still looks fine today, sitting unused by me after some decades. I wouldn't hesitate to use it if I once tried to shoot that powder again. I have tossed some powder in the yard when it was suspicious, and will agaln if called to do so. 
Be safe and at least get some other learned opinion if at all uncertain. Burntpowder, above, is just about correct- pay attention to him, if not to me.
  
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burntwater
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Re: Old powder
Reply #9 - Jun 22nd, 2025 at 7:27pm
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calledflyer wrote on Jun 22nd, 2025 at 1:07pm:
I had not intended to send anyone out to shoot any old powder, regardless of age or condition. The can of #5 I shot was in perfect shape, dark, even and in a wholly unmarred can. 
The smell had vanished, if it ever had one. And, the first loads were shot in a Ruger, prior to loading some up for the Colt SA. 
I have shot old powders in other cases, just not a long-forgotten one like the above. I have some 2400 that was old when I got it, and still looks fine today, sitting unused by me after some decades. I wouldn't hesitate to use it if I once tried to shoot that powder again. I have tossed some powder in the yard when it was suspicious, and will agaln if called to do so. 
Be safe and at least get some other learned opinion if at all uncertain. Burntpowder, above, is just about correct- pay attention to him, if not to me.


Please accept my apology if it read that way. It was not my intention at all. I guess sometimes I get immersed in some technical crap and forget the way it can impact the OP's original intent. 

Rick
  
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calledflyer
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Re: Old powder
Reply #10 - Jun 23rd, 2025 at 9:52am
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Burntwater, no offence taken. I need, now and then, a fellow to make a counterpoint when I manage to miss my message in a post. Or conversation. 
In this case, it seemed as if I'd cavalierly used whatever powder suited my wishes without due respect for the possibility of trouble by my act- something we all do with every reload we create. Since we ordinarily do it without consciencely thinking, I failed to bring it up in an instance where it would have been most appropriate. 
  
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Babydriver
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Re: Old powder
Reply #11 - Jun 24th, 2025 at 4:43pm
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I know the replies have all dealt with smokeless. 
Black powder. I have cans of Goex 2F, 3F, etc from 1992. Stored  properly and it’s no different from new.
  
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Re: Old powder
Reply #12 - Jun 24th, 2025 at 5:42pm
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Babydriver wrote on Jun 24th, 2025 at 4:43pm:
I know the replies have all dealt with smokeless. 
Black powder. I have cans of Goex 2F, 3F, etc from 1992. Stored  properly and it’s no different from new.


Apples to oranges.
  
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ndnchf
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Re: Old powder
Reply #13 - Jun 30th, 2025 at 6:45am
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FWIW, a few years ago I reloaded and fired an original .56-50 Spencer cartridge using the original 155+ year old powder. Check out my video to see how it went.


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« Last Edit: Jun 30th, 2025 at 11:44am by ndnchf »  
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steveu
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Re: Old powder
Reply #14 - Jun 30th, 2025 at 9:25am
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yamoon wrote on Jun 20th, 2025 at 9:42pm:
I have a full pound of IMR4198 I bought in 1984, when I open the can there is still a strong solvent smell. What are your thoughts on using it?
Thanks Mike


Is the inside of the can rusty? Does it have an acrid smell?  If yes to either, I would not shoot it.  I fertilized the lawn with 33 pounds of 1994 vintage N150 that went bad.  The sealed bottles were bloated and the acrid smell was definitely present.   
YMMV,
Steve
  
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