Here are photos of the 20" scope I got on a Stevens 44 1/2 #45 gallery rifle.  THe barrel was never cut for a front sight and the barrel address is on the flat clockwise from the top.

The rifle serial number is in the 59xx range.

How does this compare with your scope in terms of the length and the mounts?

Note: I suspect the flat spring on the rear mount is a replacement - it's soldered in place.  I don't know if the front spring is original or not.  It's pinned to the base.

A Stevens 368 is a 6X, a 388 is an 8X. Both made in the 1920's. The 388 is much less common. These are model numbers. I've never seen serial numbers on any Stevens scopes, I am not saying that it didn't happen.

Sure shot wrote on May 31^st, 2024 at 9:20am:


Agreed, these are "generally" the model number of the scope. But with all things Stevens, "generally, usually, most often" are the key words. I have a 24 inch marked "NO 781"...so who knows.

In Tom Rowe’s American Rifles Sights book, there are a couple of scopes listed with similar numbers. Both in the 1400’s.

I would be interested to no if the scope referenced above that Marlinguy now owns, if the front mount would fit a Standard Stevens dove tail.

Schutzenbob wrote on May 31^st, 2024 at 4:17am:


Bob,  do you have any idea which year(s) those ads were published?

marlinguy wrote on May 31^st, 2024 at 9:54am:


I’m not sure, but I’m pretty sure that I have a Scope marked Stevens Arms and Tool, that has model numbers. Maybe more than one.

If scopes were marked like rifles, 1916 was the change from Stevens arm and Tool, to Stevens Arms. Not sure I’ve paid enough attention to the scope markings to catch one marked “Stevens Arms”.

Keep in mind Stevens also sold Malcolm scopes before selling  Catarac scopes that I think were marked Stevens before buying the company. Is it looks me the serialized scopes were actually made before Stevens bought the company?

Scopes made by Stevens when owned by Savage after 1920 would be marked Stevens Arms Co. Also any scopes made after 1916 would be marked Stevens Arms Company, unless they were using up old in stock tubes with the Stevens A&T marking.

Just went and checked my two long Stevens scopes and the short Stevens scope. All Marked J. Stevens Arms & Tool and both long scopes are #161 scopes. The short is a #438 in Pope mounts, so can't tell anything by  those rings.
One thing I note concerning Stevens scopes is the early ones always had a nicely rounded front ring that matches the rear ring shape, where later had a plainer flat front ring. One of my long #161's on my early straight grip Rigby has the rounded front ring like the one I got from Smoke, while the other has the flat front ring.
I try to look at every Stevens scope I see on a rifle, regardless of whether it's for sale or not. Just hoping to figure out more about them. But with changes in makers, and the factory not a lot is a for sure thing, just a guesstimate.
I collect a lot of other old scopes, but only the Stevens were plentiful enough to really get somewhat of a handle on. At least they are marked, unlike some other small company's scopes!

Another question: Here's a pic of the front ring on my 388 scope.

It has a notch for the stop on both sides of the ring.   What's up with that?

Smoke wrote on May 31^st, 2024 at 3:19pm:


I have one with the two sided notch too Bruce. Never have figured out why for sure? I thought maybe so you can turn the rings to either side and still have a notch maybe?

Tom Rowe's sight book is indeed probably better than any other source for information, but doesn't show a lot of the huge variety of scopes Stevens offered over many years. Still scope info in general is really lacking, and old catalogs are about the only resource we have beyond what Tom did in his sight book.

Just another data point, my Stevens scope is marked, "J Stevens Arms and Tool ". It is 28-1/4" OAL and marked No. 181.

frnkeore wrote on Jun 1^st, 2024 at 12:19pm:

From memory. 1928/9

I've often wondered what made a particular Stevens scope for a particular rifle? Surely it wasn't the scope tube itself, and likely it was the mounts. But why would the mounts be different for say a Win. 1885 vs. a Marlin Ballard? Both used 3/8" dovetails front and rear, except for a handful of first year Ballard rifles that had an oddball Sharps .452" front dovetail.

rkba2nd wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2024 at 3:16pm:


I doubt a 30" barrel would take a different scope for one maker vs. another. All had standard length of pull of around 13.5", so doesn't make sense to say one scope would be different for a Win. vs. a Rem., or Marlin Ballard.

Yes Smoke, but nobody is keeping score. Marlinguy  The adding four inches to the scope is to accommodate the use of sight mounting dovetails and proper eye relief for the rifle in question. If requirements overlap from one maker to another, so be it. It would seem to me that the formula is mostly meant as a help to the buyer in deciding the proper scope. Steven's taking into account mount location, eye relief, field of view etc, for the customers particular rifle. I have no idea if this was Steven's reasoning, just my read on it.

The added 4" to the scope vs. barrel length would also be the same for a Winchester, or any other brand of rifle, so not sure it has anything to do with makers? The mounts are the only thing specific to a maker, and that only pertains to the rifle makers with other than the usual 3/8" front and rear dovetails. 
Eye relief would be the only thing that could change the length of the scope vs. barrel length, as Stevens offered some scopes with extremely long eye relief. The Stevens scope on my Ballard #3 that was sent to Stevens to be rebored to .25 Stevens RF has a good 6"or 7" of eye relief, so it sits farther forward than any of my other full length scopes do.

It's also interesting that none of the Stevens catalog page illustrations I've ever seen show the nicely rounded front rings the early scopes had on them? They all show the plain flat front rings even when illustrations show a rounded rear ring.

Don't think I've ever seen a Cataract Scope Co. scope, or a  scope that looked like a Stevens, but wasn't marked. Which leads me to believe that any made for Stevens were likely marked or we'd see similar scopes unmarked eventually.

Schutzenbob wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2024 at 2:35pm:


Very cool setup! Hope I can find one I can also afford someday!

Otony,

Ed Mason was a Quaker and lived in Whittier California, which is the area where Richard Nixon (President Nixon) grew up. In the 1970's I joined Brea R&P Club which was on Union 76 property in Brea Ca., which was very near Yorba Linda where Richard Nixon was born. This is a Cataract Tool & Optical Co. Scope mounted on a Stevens rifle.

Wm Malcolm was established in 1855, about 25 years before Cataract began business. Cataract started in 1880 and sold to Stevens in I believe 1900 or 1901?

Thanks Sure shot,   I will order one. It must be fairly new, as I check their inventory fairly often, and get their catalog sent to me roughly once a month.

Past80 wrote on Jun 8^th, 2024 at 2:22pm:


I can't find that part number in any of my data? Do you know which Stevens catalog you saw this number in?

Past80 wrote on Jun 8^th, 2024 at 4:38pm:


Got it. Thanks.

PM sent