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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Black powder volume to weight? (Read 3276 times)
Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #30 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 1:46pm
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519 would/should work well in original sharps barrels, and the converted 63's.
What's the twist in that barrel.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #31 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:10pm
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Ranch13 wrote on Oct 9th, 2023 at 1:46pm:
519 would/should work well in original sharps barrels, and the converted 63's.
What's the twist in that barrel.


As close as I could measure it's between 1:29" and 1:30" twist. Seemed fairly fast, but got the same both times I checked with a tight patch.
  

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Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #32 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:21pm
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The extra powder capacity of that big case will help to stabilize bullets heavier than the 473 and 500’s  maybe go up to 750 or so but the recoil factor will go up with the heavies
It’ll be interesting to see what you can get that rifle to do
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #33 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:43pm
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Ranch13 wrote on Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:21pm:
The extra powder capacity of that big case will help to stabilize bullets heavier than the 473 and 500’s  maybe go up to 750 or so but the recoil factor will go up with the heavies
It’ll be interesting to see what you can get that rifle to do


About half the smokeless loads he had Eldorado Custom Loading build for the rifle were 678 gr. PP bullets. I had planned on melting them down, but maybe I should reconsider and at least load up enough of them to see if they're worth saving.
Thanks!
  

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SchwarzStock
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #34 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:47pm
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What is the wrapped diameter of the 678gr bullets?
  

If your rifle is not in 7.62 and you can't hit what you are aiming at with de-linked machinegun ammo you are a pretender.
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Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #35 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 4:32pm
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marlinguy wrote on Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:43pm:
Ranch13 wrote on Oct 9th, 2023 at 3:21pm:
The extra powder capacity of that big case will help to stabilize bullets heavier than the 473 and 500’s  maybe go up to 750 or so but the recoil factor will go up with the heavies
It’ll be interesting to see what you can get that rifle to do


About half the smokeless loads he had Eldorado Custom Loading build for the rifle were 678 gr. PP bullets. I had planned on melting them down, but maybe I should reconsider and at least load up enough of them to see if they're worth saving.
Thanks!


One thing to think about the heavier the bullet the longer the skank there by cutting down on powder capacity
But it’ll be a trade off I’m the recoil dept
  
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Lead Pot
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #36 - Oct 9th, 2023 at 6:49pm
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I spent a lot of time shooting my .50-90/2.5 Shiloh and I found that the larger .50 bore with a 1/22 twist shot a longer bullet then you would use in a lesser diameter caliber. I tried the shorter 1.4" and they just would not shoot well till I got up to the 1.5" long creedmoor nosed Paul Jones mould as well as a mould from Steve Brooks cut with his creedmoor nosed bullet that dropped out at 712 grains at 1.503" and I used that bullet for many years shooting long range irons and it served me well with 110 +- grains of 2F Goes express weight variances from lot to lot changes. I have shot the 3-1/2 50's and they shoot quite well when you learn to roll with the recoil but they had the slower 1/32 ? twist shooting the shorter bullets.

Kurt
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #37 - Oct 10th, 2023 at 11:25am
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The 678 gr. bullets have a length of 1.4" and were seated into the cases .85" deep. The chamber throat doesn't allow the bullets to be seated out very far before they wont chamber.
Guess I need to quit procrastinating and actually cast this chamber so I can post a picture here. Should have done it one of the several times I've had the gun apart lately, as it's a bit tricky to get all the extra pieces of the Freund action all back together without 3 hands! Trying to hold two extractors at just the right location, and ease the block partially in until it holds them, and then get it all in place is a task. Plus the takedown pin is very snug, and takes a lot of pressure to push in place. I assume it was rebuilt, and that's why it's so tight.
  

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Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #38 - Oct 10th, 2023 at 11:39am
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If you tape over the extractors removing them isn't necessary if your use cerrosafe.
Be sure to get the first inch or so of the rifling in that cast, it will help to get a good bullet diameter.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #39 - Oct 10th, 2023 at 1:30pm
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Ranch13 wrote on Oct 10th, 2023 at 11:39am:
If you tape over the extractors removing them isn't necessary if your use cerrosafe.
Be sure to get the first inch or so of the rifling in that cast, it will help to get a good bullet diameter.


Yes, I always get at least an inch of barrel rifling when doing a casting. Not too worried about the rim area as it's somewhat irrelevant for what I'd like to see. So might be able to make up a paper funnel and hopefully not end up over filling it when I pour the chamber. I did that with one of my Hepburns and the extractor cut filled with Cerrosafe, which required me to spin the barrel off to dig out the Cerrosafe. PITA but not the end of the world.
  

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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #40 - Oct 10th, 2023 at 10:39pm
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The Sharps is apart to do the casting, and I discovered a broken transfer bar. I've had it apart numerous times in the last week to check, and the 2 piece system of firing pin and separate transfer bar were fine. Today the transfer bar was snapped!
Since this is unlike originals, it appears I am going to have to figure out if one of the modern clones that use a 2 piece setup might be close enough to modify, or if an original copy might be modified into just a transfer bar by cutting the firing pin off, and shaping the rest to fit?
I've ordered one of each, and will see which is the easiest to rework. Once the two parts are here, if neither works I'll contact a gunsmith friend and see if he can tig weld this one back together?
Anyone recall the name Markus Moll a German master gunsmith who was making copies of the Freund Sharps? I'm told he was sourced for some of the worn out parts when this Sharps was restored. Not sure who he is, or if he's still alive.

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Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #41 - Oct 10th, 2023 at 11:20pm
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You might check with Shiloh on one of their transfer bars
Another place might be Rich McKinney in Ft. Collins , as he does Freund copy rifles.
Sometimes BACO has the one piece firing pins in stock.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #42 - Oct 11th, 2023 at 10:00am
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Ranch13 wrote on Oct 10th, 2023 at 11:20pm:
You might check with Shiloh on one of their transfer bars
Another place might be Rich McKinney in Ft. Collins , as he does Freund copy rifles.
Sometimes BACO has the one piece firing pins in stock.


Do the Shiloh Sharps use a one piece, or two piece firing pin?

I found Rich McKinney info in Loveland, Co. Is this the same guy?
  

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Ranch13
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #43 - Oct 11th, 2023 at 10:18am
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Shiloh uses the transfer bar and separate firing pin set up

Probably is the same guy if he's listed under gunsmith's
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Black powder volume to weight?
Reply #44 - Oct 11th, 2023 at 10:52am
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Ranch13 wrote on Oct 11th, 2023 at 10:18am:
Shiloh uses the transfer bar and separate firing pin set up

Probably is the same guy if he's listed under gunsmith's


I sent a message to Shiloh to ask if I could send them my broken transfer bar to compare to theirs and maybe buy one to rework for my Sharps.
  

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