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westerner
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Satisfaction, finally....
Jan 30th, 2023 at 9:10am
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About twenty two years ago I was informed by a noted Ballard collector that the horn tip on my Berg rifle was not original to the piece.  Man that really bugged me.  Angry  Noted collector informed me that Berg rifles never had horn tips on the forestocks. 

Recently I acquired Bill Wests book on Marlin and Ballard rifles. On page 3-12 there is pictured a Berg Ballard rifle with a separate tip on it. Has the correct Berg bead at the action.  Never say never when it comes to old rifles. Specially old custom rifles.   

And here's another one
« Last Edit: Jan 30th, 2023 at 9:27am by westerner »  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #1 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 9:45am
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Goes to show a person can never know it all. That horn tip is beautiful! Glad you could put your mind to rest. Smiley
  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #2 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 2:44pm
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Nifty palm rest to boot!!
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #3 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 3:22pm
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The forearms, horn tips, and even the checkering patterns look a lot like what came from Marlin factory on deluxe Ballard models. So maybe Berg simply retained the factory forearms when he built new buttstocks for some rifles?
  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #4 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 4:51pm
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Berg w/o bead.
« Last Edit: Jan 31st, 2023 at 11:16am by Rebel »  
WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #5 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:08pm
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marlinguy wrote on Jan 30th, 2023 at 3:22pm:
The forearms, horn tips, and even the checkering patterns look a lot like what came from Marlin factory on deluxe Ballard models. So maybe Berg simply retained the factory forearms when he built new buttstocks for some rifles?


So are you thinking they glued the beads on the Ballard forestocks?  Pretty crafty guys back then.  Sure to get knocked off though. The glue they used back then didn't last very long.
  
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MrTipUp
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #6 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:18pm
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The glue they used back then didn't last very long.

And where did you get that bit of misinformation.  I've worked on many glue-assembled pieces that were made as far back as the 1700s, when hide glue (which is admittedly very water-soluble) was the glue of choice.  Given reasonable care, glue failures in such pieces are very uncommon and are usually limited to veneer "bubbles".

Bill Lawrence
« Last Edit: Jan 31st, 2023 at 11:39pm by MrTipUp »  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #7 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:32pm
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I got that from my experience with hide glue. Replacing hundreds of cue tips in the sixties and the few glue joints I've encountered with old rifles.  Have seen old cabinetry where glue joints dried out and failed. I have always assumed the glue used was hide glue.  Peeling veneer, etc etc.  I remember grandpa sticking with hide glue over the new fangled Elmer's glue. Gramps was a cabinet maker/carpenter. 

Also, gluing a radial strip of wood around a forend would subject it to expansion and contraction which usually makes a glue joint fail.

But I could be full of beans.
  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #8 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:49pm
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Got to thinking about it just now. If a block of wood about 3/8 or whatever it takes to make the bead were glued to the end of the forearm.  Yes, that's a possibility. Some Berg Ballard rifles appear to have Ballard forearms for sure.

I did look at my rifle and the bead is part of the forestock. The horn tip lacks the grooves.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #9 - Jan 31st, 2023 at 11:29am
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Not sure Joe, but it's possible they removed wood off the rear of the forearm and made the bead from a separate piece if they wanted to save the original forearm. Is your bead of the same wood, or does it look like different wood?

Posted this before I saw your 2nd post Joe.

Ballard  glued on horn tips, and ebony inserts, so I think just about anything could be glued by someone as talented as Berg.
One thing I have noted over the years is palm rests and checkering. Custom stocks usually make sure the checkering isn't covered by the palm rest, where factory forearms with palm rests added often cover checkering when they're added.
  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #10 - Jan 31st, 2023 at 1:35pm
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My forend is one piece.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #11 - Jan 31st, 2023 at 8:02pm
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westerner wrote on Jan 31st, 2023 at 1:35pm:
My forend is one piece.


Sounds like it's not a factory Ballard forearm.
  
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Re: Satisfaction, finally....
Reply #12 - Jan 31st, 2023 at 9:50pm
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No, it's not. But I've always known that.
  
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