ahhh.it was Newicks book,i was Wong that I thought I'd read it PS magazine.
thanks for the info.

Marginally OT, but a few (or more) years back, when I was really digging into .22 Shorts and shelf life, I found a reference to rimfire accuracy standards by Peters.  In the late 1890s to circa 1910, before WW1, they apparently tested their match-grade rimfire production frequently, maybe even daily.  

Test distance was 25 yards (for Shorts) and every shot had to hit inside a circle the size of a dime (0.700").  Probably for King's Semi-Smokeless, not BP.  Peters had captured the market for rimfire target ammunition and worked hard to keep it.   

The reference did not say that they tested from the bench, but how would you do it?

I remember seeing a lot of impressive targets in the pages of Shooting and Fishing, but I can't recall any lists of records and years made.  Certain people had range records attributed to them in the match results published, but it might get beaten the next match.  A list of people, records and years like one sees nowadays I can't recall.

One of the problems was that in the black powder days of the 1890s, everybody had their own idea of the perfect target.  Different clubs and ranges hd their own target sizes, different matches had different shapes, and even targets that looked the same might have different size rings and centers.

A.C. Gould, S&F's Publisher/Editor, was one of the first to address this problem, coming up with a Standard American Target with a fixed size of bullseye and rings.  IIRC, it had an "11" circle at the center to break ties in benchrest shooting contests.

Just like that guitar amp where the volume dial goes up to "11" when that extra deafening is necessary.  Or the "X" ring today.

Very few people got ten centers for ten shots on that target at forty rods or 200 yards off the bench back then.  I think Eugene Patridge was one of them, and the lady he married (Miss Minnie Shenck? can't remember) also pulled it off.

One of my heroes, Francis Rabbeth ("J. Francis") got it several times but never was credited, because he never announced a start and finish when he fired.  He was always too busy experimenting with loads and rifles to bother with how competitive he might have been.

What about the original bisley matches in the uk? Surely there is info on that somewhere, I can recall an article about teams from around the world going there to compete with muzzle loaders and whitworth rifles
Gumpy

Grumpy gumpy wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2023 at 5:26pm:


I don't remember reading that they shot BP BR at Bisley.

Mike, the best BP BR target I ever shot was with my 38-55 breech muzzle loader using iron sights. I used a duplex load.  My score was 245 7C on the German ring target at 200 yards.  I never came anywhere close to that using fixed ammo.

Okay, but I don't think they shot any BP BR.

There is a lot of good information on the level of accuracy with black powder BR in the book by Dr. Franklin Mann  ""The Bullets flight from muzzle to target""  It contains numerous reprints of original targets.
Another source available on line is the results of the Creedmoor match between the Irish and American teams in 1874 at Creedmoor Long Island.  The Americans shot cartridge guns while the Irish shot Rigby muzzleloaders.

I also don't see anything being mentioned about the slug gunners who did use BP and they also shot some amazing groups, targets, scores and have continued to do so and off of a bench.