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ndnchf
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.25-25 #2 rolling block - separated case neck!
Dec 31st, 2022 at 11:42am
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I'm walking around a gunshow and just bought a nice #2 rolling block in .25-25. What brass, if any can it be made from? Since I'm still at the show, I'd like to get some brass if I can. Thanks,
Steve
« Last Edit: Jan 1st, 2023 at 5:32pm by ndnchf »  
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Dellet
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #1 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 12:35pm
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Nothing I’m aware of. Bertram makes it, Buffalo arms generally has some.

You can get close with 5.6x50 204 ruger. Same way as 22 hornet to 25 rf or closer to  converting 223 to 25-20 SS. More work to the base tho.

Use the .378 rim and swage/turn the base down to around .310 or less depending on your chamber. I have done 25-21 this way. But not sure there is a case long enough to get a full length 25-25. Finished case length  needs to be about 2.400”.

  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #2 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 12:55pm
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Dellet wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 12:35pm:
Nothing I’m aware of. Bertram makes it, Buffalo arms generally has some.

You can get close with 5.6x50 204 ruger. Same way as 22 hornet to 25 rf or closer to  converting 223 to 25-20 SS. More work to the base tho.

Use the .378 rim and swage/turn the base down to around .310 or less depending on your chamber. I have done 25-21 this way. But not sure there is a case long enough to get a full length 25-25. Finished case length  needs to be about 2.400”.



Thanks. Still walking around the show looking for gold. I think I have some new, unformed jamison. 25-20SS. Not sure of the length. Perhaps it would work?
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #3 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 1:25pm
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ndnchf wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 12:55pm:
Dellet wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 12:35pm:
Nothing I’m aware of. Bertram makes it, Buffalo arms generally has some.

You can get close with 5.6x50 204 ruger. Same way as 22 hornet to 25 rf or closer to  converting 223 to 25-20 SS. More work to the base tho.

Use the .378 rim and swage/turn the base down to around .310 or less depending on your chamber. I have done 25-21 this way. But not sure there is a case long enough to get a full length 25-25. Finished case length  needs to be about 2.400”.



Thanks. Still walking around the show looking for gold. I think I have some new, unformed jamison. 25-20SS. Not sure of the length. Perhaps it would work?

Still be pretty short.

Are you familiar with a 25-21? You can make a 25-21 by cutting about 3/8” off a 25-25.

A Hornet case is about the right diameter, and half the length.

Top row 25 rf, 25-25, 25-21, 25-20 ss

Bottom row is 25-21 from 204 ruger and a 204 ruger. 
25 rf cf from Hornet


  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #4 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 3:52pm
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Not really familiar with 25-21 or 25-25. Something new to learn about! Just the .25 RF made from .22 Hornet - I've been making a lot of those.  I just got home. I'm going to look closer over the rifle and get some photos. 

Thanks!
Steve
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #5 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 5:16pm
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Hmmm, not sure what's going on with the chamber. It looks like it might have part of a case stuck in it.
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #6 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 7:21pm
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Or someone made a long throat to use a short case?
  
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GT
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #7 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 12:44am
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"Or someone made a long throat to use a short case?"

That's what I'd guess.

If you make the 25-25 from 223 brass, start with 223 Basic from Starline.  Make a mandrel that fits the inside of that basic brass exact... smoke your mandrel with a lamp so the fit is near perfect- make sure there is room on the outside of the mandrel for the nibbing process to make the case 9/16" longer.  I use a single roll knurling tool that I made hardened, then polished smooth.  Following this, run the brass through the neck of a 7mm Mauser die with a punch that has a rim forming feature.   Skin the base to spec, then start in with the 25-25 forming dies,  I ended up making three of these... that's it in a nutshell...   
I spent a better part of a day making parts and dies, still another part of a day making brass - in the end probably had 25 cases turn out.  25-20SS are a breeze and 25-21 are a little more of a project, the 25-25 are difficult to say the least.  They need annealing as you go along, this was one of my biggest hang-ups.  I didn't make good enough notes and don't recall the times to anneal. 
Greg
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #8 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 2:34pm
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GT wrote on Jan 1st, 2023 at 12:44am:
"Or someone made a long throat to use a short case?"

That's what I'd guess.

If you make the 25-25 from 223 brass, start with 223 Basic from Starline.  Make a mandrel that fits the inside of that basic brass exact... smoke your mandrel with a lamp so the fit is near perfect- make sure there is room on the outside of the mandrel for the nibbing process to make the case 9/16" longer.  I use a single roll knurling tool that I made hardened, then polished smooth.  Following this, run the brass through the neck of a 7mm Mauser die with a punch that has a rim forming feature.   Skin the base to spec, then start in with the 25-25 forming dies,  I ended up making three of these... that's it in a nutshell...  
I spent a better part of a day making parts and dies, still another part of a day making brass - in the end probably had 25 cases turn out.  25-20SS are a breeze and 25-21 are a little more of a project, the 25-25 are difficult to say the least.  They need annealing as you go along, this was one of my biggest hang-ups.  I didn't make good enough notes and don't recall the times to anneal. 
Greg


Thanks GT, I appreciate the input.  I need to figure out what's going on with the chamber before going any further. I'll try to do a cast this week.
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #9 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 3:51pm
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I wonder if it's feasible to make that loooong case by soldering an extension to a shorter one?

CHRIS
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #10 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 5:22pm
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I dug out my Teslong borescope and took a look at the chamber.  in the photo above, what looks like the step closes to the breech end is actually a slight shoulder. It looks sharper than it really is.  The second step is a broken off case neck.  In the below images, the ragged edge is the rear of the case neck, the clean edge is at the front.

The last photo is the shoulder.

Suggestions on getting the case neck out?  I can do a chamber cast if necessary. Maybe it will grab it, maybe not?
Thanks,
Steve

« Last Edit: Jan 1st, 2023 at 5:30pm by ndnchf »  
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Re: .25-25 #2 rolling block - separated case neck!
Reply #11 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 6:22pm
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I would try chamber cast first and try to drive it out with a brass rod.
If you get it out I will send you an original case for you to breech seat with.
Send me a PM with your address and I will send you one.  Charlie
  
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Re: .25-25 Stevens #2 rolling block
Reply #12 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 6:29pm
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rgchristensen wrote on Jan 1st, 2023 at 3:51pm:
I wonder if it's feasible to make that loooong case by soldering an extension to a shorter one?

CHRIS

A hornet case would work.
  
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Re: .25-25 #2 rolling block - separated case neck!
Reply #13 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 6:29pm
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cheatin_charlie wrote on Jan 1st, 2023 at 6:22pm:
I would try chamber cast first and try to drive it out with a brass rod.
If you get it out I will send you an original case for you to breech seat with.
Send me a PM with your address and I will send you one.  Charlie


Thanks Charlie - PM sent.
  
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Re: .25-25 #2 rolling block - separated case neck!
Reply #14 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 6:58pm
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The 25-25 is a straight taper cartridge. What I have measures .300” at the base, .280” at the neck and 2.380” long. That first step should not be there.

25-20 SS is .315” at the base.
25-20 win .348”

A quick measure of the base of the chamber might confirm if someone re-chambered.

What’s in the chamber looks to be about the right spot for a case to separate if it had a cannelure(?) stop ring for the bullet in the case.
  
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