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32-20 and BP, some testing (Read 2343 times)

MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	32-20 and BP, some testing Aug 16^th, 2021 at 5:20am	Print Post
	Yesterday I went out to shoot my 30-20 BP match rifle, a Small-actioned BSA with a 1:12 twist barrel at 100m Goal was experimenting with the modified Pope bullet 308403 at 172gr, 30:1 alloy, and cleaning between shots. The ammunition was 'semi-breech-seated' - i.e. I seated the bullet with a plugged case and loaded a charged case after seating the bullet. The bullet base, however, is still in the case, and not in front of it. No worries re. air gaps, but rather that I do seem to get a hard crud ring if I seat the bullet ahead of the case mouth. 1st shots were wiped with 2 moist ballistol / water patches between shots. Ptaches were wetted, and then squeezed with a potato ricer. Accuracy was pretty lousy, I presume because there still was too much moisture in the barrel. About 6 MOA. Next try was again 2 moist patches, followed with a dry one. POI dropped quite a bit, but accuracy became much more interesting. I changed target, and went for score, this provided pretty decent accuracy if I did my thing. I was shooting, prone, with sling, no rest, so I did pull a few shots. When I did my thing right, Shots went in about 2 MOA (size of the 10-ring), which is pretty close to what I am capable of. Bottom line, the little rifle is pretty sensitive to cleaning procedure / barrel condition, too wet and accuracy goes to hell. Not wet enough, and bullet seating / resistance becomes an issue, which - again - has a serious impact on accuracy. The dry patch after 2 moist ones seems to be a good solution, wet VFG cleaning pellets also seem to work. Next time may be try 1 wet, 1 dry, who knows? Small bores and BP do present some additional challenges...


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GT Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2143 Location: Northeast Wyoming Joined: Jun 28^th, 2015	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #1 - Aug 16^th, 2021 at 5:54am	Print Post
	Interesting, what powder are you using 3F? cards? lube? I'm asking as someday soon when I finish it, I have a Ballard in an undetermined 25 cal that's going to be an experiment. I've experienced issues in BP and small bores, just not smart enough to quit. Greg

	"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk" T. A. Edison "The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right" M.T.
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MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #2 - Aug 16^th, 2021 at 6:13am	Print Post
	Powder is Swiss 1 1/2Fg, 17.9 grains. Lube is a homemade brew, and a single quite thick card overpowder wad. The 1 1/2fg might be surprising, but shoots better than the finer stuff. And logical if you think it through.


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Grumpy gumpy Full Member Offline Posts: 214 Location: australia Joined: Jul 6^th, 2016	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #3 - Aug 16^th, 2021 at 6:47pm	Print Post
	I would try the "one wet, one dry" patching. It has given the best results in most of my rifles. The wet patch is quite damp, not dripping , then after the dry one the bore is probably still just damp. Though I would make sure that the chamber is dry, but you would already know that Gumpy


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CharleHunter Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 364 Joined: Feb 8^th, 2019	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #4 - Aug 16^th, 2021 at 11:55pm	Print Post
	Following this post with interest as I will shortly have a Rimmed 300 Blackout low wall up and running. Plan is to use smokeless but also run it with BP in our regular Ring Target shoot. (BP, open sights, lead bullet - this is the extent of the rules!)


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MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #5 - Aug 17^th, 2021 at 5:15am	Print Post
	of the things I learned is that the chamber configuration, more specifically throat / leade, is pretty important when it comes to handling fouling. My old barrel had a conical transition area from chamber mouth to rifling (after the 45-degree case stop), exact angle still to be determined, and it cheerfully shot well with just about any fouling management (this was a Schultz & Larsen 15"twist barrel). The current Lothar Walther with the new chamber is much more picky as to fouling management, but I'm finally starting to get a handle on it. This chamber has a .309 freebore .100 long, followed by the gradual taper into the rifling, and it also is a min-spec chamber. It also is a 12 twist barrel. FWIW, all my shooting is prone, with sling, no rest, so that also has to be taken into account when looking at my groups. My current take is that the little .30-20 (32-20 with .308 groove barrel)will shoot competitively out to 300m for BPTR - which is more than I expected. But as a short range target round, provided you are willing to handle the delicate fouling management, it really is an advantage. The rifle fits and balances better, it recoils way less, it consumes much less powder and lead... And provided you do everything right, you don't give up anything in accuracy. It would even make a pretty good offhand rifle, with its balance / weight.


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art_ruggiero Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1158 Location: CT Joined: Dec 14^th, 2008	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #6 - Aug 17^th, 2021 at 9:30am	Print Post
	gert could you post some pics? thanks art


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MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #7 - Aug 18^th, 2021 at 3:51pm	Print Post
	You mean the rifle? Meanwhile, the wood has been stripped and refinished with an alkanet oil finish, a new buttplate has been installed, a new tang sight more in the style othe original fitted, but.... The rifle remains the same.
	« Last Edit: Aug 18^th, 2021 at 4:18pm by MartiniBelgian »

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Barrabruce Junior Member Offline Posts: 77 Location: Australia Joined: Mar 30^th, 2017	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #8 - Aug 18^th, 2021 at 4:33pm	Print Post
	Hmm nicely done. How do you clean between shots? Through the breach end some how or muzzle?


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MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #9 - Aug 19^th, 2021 at 1:40am	Print Post
	Flexible cleaning rod, from the rear. Not really an issue with the small Martini action. The PH rear sight has meanwhile been replaced with a fold down tang sight, which makes it even easier. A nylon or delrin rod works pretty well. The action is a 12/15 BSA, converted to CF.


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Skalkaho Oldtimer Online Posts: 806 Location: Montana Joined: Sep 29^th, 2006	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #10 - Aug 19^th, 2021 at 8:52am	Print Post
	What velocity are you getting in your load?Are you able to get around 1400 FPS ? I would think 2F or 3F may be it.I have my fixed smokeless figured on my 32 Ideal Zischang.BP will be the next.....

	May the Bullet Gods be with you.......
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art_ruggiero Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1158 Location: CT Joined: Dec 14^th, 2008	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #11 - Aug 19^th, 2021 at 10:40am	Print Post
	thanks gert art


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MartiniBelgian Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1712 Location: Aarschot Joined: Jun 7^th, 2004	Re: 32-20 and BP, some testing Reply #12 - Aug 20^th, 2021 at 3:20pm	Print Post
	Skalkaho wrote on Aug 19^th, 2021 at 8:52am: What velocity are you getting in your load?Are you able to get around 1400 FPS ? I would think 2F or 3F may be it.I have my fixed smokeless figured on my 32 Ideal Zischang.BP will be the next..... Haven't chrono'd the loads yet, but I would be very surprised in getting those MV's. Certainly with the heavy bullets I'm using, 152 and 172 grains.


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