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Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle (Read 7086 times)

Rebel Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4292 Location: Rockets and Race Cars Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #15 - Nov 16^th, 2020 at 10:35pm	Print Post
	Baystate block

	WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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bobw Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1531 Location: NW, Iowa Joined: Mar 19^th, 2013	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #16 - Nov 16^th, 2020 at 11:09pm	Print Post
	Rebel, interesting concept. Couple questions though. Does it have a two piece firing pin or it the the pin bore loose enough so that the pin doesn’t bind up? And how is it locked into place?

	Robert Warren
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uscra112 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4079 Location: Switzerland of Ohio Joined: May 7^th, 2007	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #17 - Nov 17^th, 2020 at 1:35am	Print Post
	Interesting thread, as I have a Bay State in .32 Long. Have only seen one other in the flesh - should have bought it but didn't. Out of scrap aluminum I made this breech seater, and shot .32 wadcutters in it that way for while. Wasn't stellar accuracy, more like 2 MOA, but not to be sneezed at considering age and bore condition.

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uscra112 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4079 Location: Switzerland of Ohio Joined: May 7^th, 2007	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #18 - Nov 17^th, 2020 at 1:48am	Print Post
	Also have a .22 H&A medium frame that some anonymous 'smith lavished a lot of care on. Linered the barrel, and scrupulously fitted that stupid blade extractor that H&A used so that it actually works! Gunbroker auction, paid a pittance because I was the only bidder. Have yet to fire a round thru it, ashamed to say. This on top of my 722, 822, .22 Junior and 932, the last converted to fire .32 Long Colt CF. I have a soft spot for H&A, I have.

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Rebel Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4292 Location: Rockets and Race Cars Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #19 - Nov 17^th, 2020 at 8:39am	Print Post
	BobW, The Baystate firing pin is "loose" and the dovetail retained by a setscrew near the link. I have one of these (H&A) in 32-20 and it's a favorite. Aaron
	« Last Edit: Nov 26^th, 2020 at 9:45am by Rebel »
	WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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bobw Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1531 Location: NW, Iowa Joined: Mar 19^th, 2013	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #20 - Nov 17^th, 2020 at 12:07pm	Print Post
	Thanks for the info Aaron. 32-20 would be fun. uscra, really don’t know much about breech seating or wadcutters but if I remember correctly when I was a teenager everyone use to hang out at a gas station in town. Everyone showed up About 5:30 everyday and several of the older guys would shoot into a trap in one the car stalls. Winter in Iowa gets long! They shot revolvers and pretty sure they said they were shooting wad cutters. Boy was it loud! Probably one of the reasons i’m half deaf. Bob

	Robert Warren
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jbinnh Participating Member Offline Posts: 27 Joined: Mar 21^st, 2011	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #21 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 8:47am	Print Post
	Where would one look to find a tang sight as I see on some of the fine pictures above? I have my grandfathers 22 but the open sights are becoming a problem for me. Have looked at guns shows for years thinking I might run across a tang sight but no luck. The hole spacing is approx 1 1/8". Thanks for any info. John


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Rebel Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4292 Location: Rockets and Race Cars Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #22 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 9:43am	Print Post
	My H&A in 32-20 has Remington hole spacing on the tang. Aaron

	WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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kootne Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 441 Location: Libby, Mt. Joined: Mar 6^th, 2012	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #23 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 10:39am	Print Post
	Hi John, the 1-1/8" is the old Marlin spacing, first used on Ballards then lever guns. They are probably the second most common spacing after Winchester. E-bay is a good place to look, there are also second generation (currently made) Lyman and Marble sights available. There are other currently made repops and re-interpretations made by a number of suppliers. Among the best is MVA. There are others, the least expensive are imported. So there you go, a little googling and I'm sure you can find something that suits your eye and hopefully fits your budget.

	You can't make good decisions without good information.
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jbinnh Participating Member Offline Posts: 27 Joined: Mar 21^st, 2011	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #24 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 11:33am	Print Post
	Thanks guys. Will renew my quest. John


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Chuckster Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2238 Location: Colorado Joined: May 15^th, 2008	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #25 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 2:18pm	Print Post
	The similarities between a Hopkins & Allen and a Walker-Hepburn are amazing. One of the cheapest vs. one of the most expensive. Both operate almost the same way, except H&A got rid of the extreme drop and the Walker has an improved extractor Often wondered who copied who. Don't know the dates. Chuck


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uscra112 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4079 Location: Switzerland of Ohio Joined: May 7^th, 2007	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #26 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 3:45pm	Print Post
	A Walker-Hepburn. Had to search that one. An underlever version of the Remington Hepburn, yes? Davenport's patent for what evolved into the Hopkins and Allen is dated 1885. Rifles were built on it until (?)1887. If what I found on the Walker-Hepburn is correct, Walker's patent is dated 1886. Davenport's original design as manufactured by Bay State Arms had a far better extractor than the H&A medium frames. H&A's extractor was one of the great crimes committed on Davenport's design when they bought him out. They were trying for a switch-barrel gun that could accommodate everything from .22 rimfire to 20 gauge using the same extractor. I think some ancestor of Rube Goldberg musta been a wheel at Merwin Hulbert. H&A produced some real kludges while they were beholden to M-H. That "set trigger" you find on some medium frame rifles is another prime example. And the four-piece barrel-retaining taper pin found in Juniors. /rant off
	« Last Edit: Nov 26^th, 2020 at 4:18pm by uscra112 »
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bobw Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1531 Location: NW, Iowa Joined: Mar 19^th, 2013	Re: Hopkins and Allen 22 Rifle Reply #27 - Nov 26^th, 2020 at 5:20pm	Print Post
	Ok, I just gave my rifle to the neighbors kid.....well, not really. And what’s wrong with the extractor? You just need patience, good fingernails and tip it up every time to get the empty out!

	Robert Warren
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