Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 [3]  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Casting Problem - SOLVED! (Read 13438 times)
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27th, 2008
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #30 - Apr 21st, 2020 at 6:44pm
Print Post  
jfeldman wrote on Apr 21st, 2020 at 4:28pm:
Somewhere in the recent past I recall a comment, I believe by JLouis about dipping one corner of the mold in the melt to help it retain heat.  Maybe on the side that doesn't want to fill out?

Regards,
Joe

I do that when the mold is 10 or 20 degrees too cool.  I normally doesn't have a dramatic affect on the melt temp.
  

"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
hepburnman
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 402
Location: NJ
Joined: Mar 22nd, 2015
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #31 - Apr 22nd, 2020 at 4:08pm
Print Post  
I believe the suggestion to dip an edge of the mold into the melt was to heat up the mold quickly before the start of casting. If you do this while casting I think your bullet weights will change significantly.

I ordered a graver tool today and will chase out the vent lines a little to see if this helps.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27th, 2008
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #32 - Apr 22nd, 2020 at 5:22pm
Print Post  
hepburnman wrote on Apr 22nd, 2020 at 4:08pm:
I believe the suggestion to dip an edge of the mold into the melt was to heat up the mold quickly before the start of casting. If you do this while casting I think your bullet weights will change significantly.

I ordered a graver tool today and will chase out the vent lines a little to see if this helps.

If you dip an edge of a cold mold into the melt, the temperature of the melt will drop significantly.
  

"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3559
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #33 - Apr 22nd, 2020 at 6:30pm
Print Post  
This is an entertaining thread. I think it's time that it got renamed, though= to Casting Problems Created
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JS47
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1265
Location: Arizona
Joined: Oct 12th, 2012
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #34 - Apr 22nd, 2020 at 9:48pm
Print Post  
" Bullets also need a lot of encouragement to drop out."

Lapping the mould with some 320 grit compound will usually cure a balky mold. The dimensions aren't changed but the small burrs that are present will be removed. It's just a simple polishing job that sometimes works wonders. The custom molds I use haven't needed the treatment but the commercial molds often have. I have to admit though that the Lyman mold I bought a few weeks ago drops bullets as well as any mold I have. Also, 900 degrees seems a little hot.

JS
« Last Edit: Apr 22nd, 2020 at 9:59pm by JS47 »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Mick B
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1004
Location: 19 Ian Nicol St watson ACT aus
Joined: Apr 11th, 2013
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #35 - Apr 23rd, 2020 at 8:11pm
Print Post  
JS
How do you lap the mould ?.
Mike.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JS47
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1265
Location: Arizona
Joined: Oct 12th, 2012
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #36 - Apr 26th, 2020 at 3:03pm
Print Post  
I drill a pilot hole in the center of the bullet. It's best to do it with a drill press while the bullet is held in the mold block. I've also chucked a bullet lightly in the lathe to drill it. Trying to use a hand hold drill sounds a little risky. I have a long sheetrock screw with the head cut off that I chuck up in my cordless drill and screw it into the pilot hole. From there I coat a bullet with a little 320 grit Clover compound and spin it for a few seconds while holding it in the mold. Keep the excess grit wiped off the mold block faces. It usually doesn't take much lapping to make a vast difference in how well the bullets drop. I had one commercial mold that required a good beating to get the bullets to drop. After a lapping session the bullets popped right out. Remember not to drill the pilot hole clear through the bullet!

There's a lot of info out there on lapping bullet molds. Phil Sharpe wrote about it in the 1930's.

JS
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JLouis
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 10625
Joined: Apr 8th, 2009
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #37 - Apr 26th, 2020 at 8:03pm
Print Post  
The typical reason for the bullets not wanting to drop out of a mould are two fold. #1 the bullet cavity was not cut dead center in the two mould block halves. #2 If lube grooves were not tapered or not being cut rounded. They would then probably have been cut square or lathe bored that way and that in itself would prevent the bullets from wanting to drop out. You can probably get away with the cavity being cut .005 thousands more on one side than the other but anymore than that will lock the one side in. Think of it as now creating a C and you can visualize what happens if going past dead center and why it is now locking the bullet in. As you know you may still be able knock the bullet out of the mould. But you still need to visualize what it will do to a once per-say perfectly round base once it's been knocked / forced out. 
In regards to dipping the front edge of the mould into the alloy when already up to temp., please go back and re-read what it was I posted in that regard. 

  

" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Mick B
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1004
Location: 19 Ian Nicol St watson ACT aus
Joined: Apr 11th, 2013
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #38 - Apr 26th, 2020 at 9:54pm
Print Post  
JS
Thanks for your clear explanation, I will give it a go.
Mike.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JS47
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1265
Location: Arizona
Joined: Oct 12th, 2012
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #39 - Apr 27th, 2020 at 10:12pm
Print Post  
JLouis,

I agree with you but would add reason #3, there are small burrs left in the cavities on the mass produced molds, for whatever reason. I have several Accurate Molds and one Hoch. All of these worked very well right out of the box. 

JS
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
hepburnman
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 402
Location: NJ
Joined: Mar 22nd, 2015
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #40 - Apr 29th, 2020 at 8:38pm
Print Post  
JS47 wrote on Apr 26th, 2020 at 3:03pm:
I drill a pilot hole in the center of the bullet. It's best to do it with a drill press while the bullet is held in the mold block. I've also chucked a bullet lightly in the lathe to drill it. Trying to use a hand hold drill sounds a little risky. I have a long sheetrock screw with the head cut off that I chuck up in my cordless drill and screw it into the pilot hole. From there I coat a bullet with a little 320 grit Clover compound and spin it for a few seconds while holding it in the mold. Keep the excess grit wiped off the mold block faces. It usually doesn't take much lapping to make a vast difference in how well the bullets drop. I had one commercial mold that required a good beating to get the bullets to drop. After a lapping session the bullets popped right out. Remember not to drill the pilot hole clear through the bullet!

There's a lot of info out there on lapping bullet molds. Phil Sharpe wrote about it in the 1930's.

JS


Should the compound have grease in it? Will any 320 grit compound with grease in it work? also, I assume you used a hand drill to spin the bullet? Any off center when trying this in a Mill could prove to be difficult unless you don't hold the mold in a rigidly mounted vise
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JLouis
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 10625
Joined: Apr 8th, 2009
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #41 - Apr 29th, 2020 at 9:52pm
Print Post  
It's real difficult to cut a mould having the base real close to being perfectly round. Using lapping compound to get rid of any burrs will very quickly make everything out of round. The best way to do it is to use a wooden tooth pick to raise up the burrs. Then to carefully stone them off using a fine and flat honing stone. If you are dead set on using a lapping compound be extremely careful as you can also increase the size of bullets parting lines and completely ruin what was once a good mould.
  

" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27th, 2008
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #42 - Apr 29th, 2020 at 10:43pm
Print Post  
I had a .32 mold by a well known maker that was out of round for my first rifle. I tried lapping it to get it round, it got worse. I just shot the oval bullet.  It shot pretty good.  I shot a 248 at a TRR match.  I asked Tommy Mason how many 248s he had shot.  He shook his head. I asked, "This must be better than I think it is, eh?"  He nodded his head yes.  That was before 250s were the norm  Shocked
  

"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JS47
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1265
Location: Arizona
Joined: Oct 12th, 2012
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #43 - Apr 30th, 2020 at 8:25pm
Print Post  
hepburnman wrote on Apr 29th, 2020 at 8:38pm:
JS47 wrote on Apr 26th, 2020 at 3:03pm:
I drill a pilot hole in the center of the bullet. It's best to do it with a drill press while the bullet is held in the mold block. I've also chucked a bullet lightly in the lathe to drill it. Trying to use a hand hold drill sounds a little risky. I have a long sheetrock screw with the head cut off that I chuck up in my cordless drill and screw it into the pilot hole. From there I coat a bullet with a little 320 grit Clover compound and spin it for a few seconds while holding it in the mold. Keep the excess grit wiped off the mold block faces. It usually doesn't take much lapping to make a vast difference in how well the bullets drop. I had one commercial mold that required a good beating to get the bullets to drop. After a lapping session the bullets popped right out. Remember not to drill the pilot hole clear through the bullet!

There's a lot of info out there on lapping bullet molds. Phil Sharpe wrote about it in the 1930's.

JS


Should the compound have grease in it? Will any 320 grit compound with grease in it work? also, I assume you used a hand drill to spin the bullet? Any off center when trying this in a Mill could prove to be difficult unless you don't hold the mold in a rigidly mounted vise


That's why I get the pilot hole centered up in the drill press vise or the lathe.  Sure, there is a little wobble when I spin the bullet in the mold with the hand held drill. Let's not over complicate this job. All we are trying to do is to remove a few very small burrs and machining marks. Doing so won't change the dimensions of the cavities. I've tried, like Schuetzenmeister, to round out an out of round mold by lapping. All I ended up with was a little larger out of round bullet. Shooting out of round bullets is a whole nuther subject.

JS
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
hepburnman
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 402
Location: NJ
Joined: Mar 22nd, 2015
Re: Casting Problem - SOLVED!
Reply #44 - May 17th, 2020 at 2:02pm
Print Post  
For my problem Saeco #740 mold I purchased a graver tool (made a handle too) and engraved all the air vent lines. Problem is now solved! All lube bands are now filling out completely and I'm back up to what I remember to be the full casted bullet weight when I first received this mold. Its maybe 25 years old and I've casted every year with it. Maybe somehow the lines got crudded up over time?

Now that I have your attention. Smiley I had to make a Bibb Seat for a shower control stem for a 100 year old house. I tried purchasing one but it was supposed to be 21/32 x 24 TPI but it was delivered as 22 TPI. Can't get a response from the on-line company so, I had to adapt my gunsmithing talents and tools for this domestic purpose! What ever gets it done! The one I made is on the right in the pictures.  Cheesy
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 [3] 
Send TopicPrint