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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) 40/65 (Read 8478 times)
gunlaker
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Re: 40/65
Reply #15 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 10:05am
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I stick the newspaper wad between the LDPE wad and the bullet.  The idea is to help prevent the LDPE wad from adhering to the bullet.  I'm not convinced that it has helped anything to be honest, but the local newspaper is free Smiley

Chris.
  
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Oakdale
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Re: 40/65
Reply #16 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 10:20am
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Chris,

I’ve seen that concept in quite a few posts, here and on other forums. 

As you try to imagine the wad sticking to the bullet base as the bullet is flying down range....and spinning....you have to try hard to convince yourself that it can happen! Especially if you wiped the base of the bullet off. But who knows....

That is one nice target. Scope or iron sights?

Tom
  
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beltfed
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Re: 40/65
Reply #17 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 11:24am
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If you shoot a bullet like this from your 40-65, no need for
the newsprint between bullet and ldpe wad.
Load:
WWfireformed cases
F150 primer seated thru tgt paper
74.5 gr Swiss 1.5
0.060 LDPE wad
371 gr DDEPP bullet/Roselle tracing paper.
Rifle:  Rebuilt Hi wall, K&P barrel, 16 twist

  
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beltfed
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Re: 40/65
Reply #18 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 11:27am
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Oh, the above was shot at 100yds.
Below is another group/score from my 40-65
at Lodi, 800yds.  Bullet here was my 371 gr
Elliptical Minigroove.  Here, I did use newsprint
between bullet and ldpe wad. 70 gr Swiss 1.5 in 
FF R-P cases.
beltfed/arnie
« Last Edit: Mar 27th, 2020 at 9:31pm by beltfed »  
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Oakdale
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Re: 40/65
Reply #19 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 11:30am
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Arnie,

Scope, iron sights? Distance?

Tom
  
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Oakdale
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Re: 40/65
Reply #20 - Mar 23rd, 2020 at 11:34am
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Arnie,

Looks like you have only maybe 1/16” or less of paper extending beyond the bullet base?

Tom
  
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beltfed
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Re: 40/65
Reply #21 - Mar 24th, 2020 at 9:01am
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For my DDEPP bullet
Probably 3/32" of paper is folded over the base.
The bullet seats on to the LDPE wad about 0.100-0.125"
into case mouth
WW FF cases/F150LP/74.5gr Swiss 1.5/0.060LDPEwad
bullet is 371 gr DDEPP, Chronos 1402fps over my Oehler
33
The similarly profiled 371 E-Minigroove bullet seats same as
the DDEPP bullet. The DDEPP bullet was modelled from
the successful 371 E-Mini
beltfed/arnie
  
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macktruckfarm
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Re: 40/65
Reply #22 - Mar 24th, 2020 at 12:38pm
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Artie, what brass do you fireform your 40-65 brass from?

Thanks, Ed
  
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Jimsan
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Re: 40/65
Reply #23 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 2:48pm
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Reading in "Loading Cartridges For The Oeiginal .45-70 Springfield Rifle and Carbine" by J.S. and Pat Wolf, 1991/Chapter Primer and Flash Hole Size - Quote - Obtaining even ignitiona of a comopressed black powder charge is not as easy as you have been led oto believe. True, black powdeer is easily ignited in loosoe or uncompressed charges where the primer flash can penetrate between all the grains; a compressed charge has all the
powder grains tightly locked together. Upon firing, the compressed charge is moved slightly forward, during which the grains become loosened and can be ignite. Insufficient ignition occurs when the primer flash through the modern .081 flash hole cannot penetrate the charge sufficiently to cause the bullet base to expand for proper fit in the barrel. The flash hole of the case should be enlarged to .096 to equal the original size of the Arsenal production. I am using Starmine Brass and am prepared to enlarge the flash hole with a #41 drill (.096) bit. This should gain a smaller extreme in velocity when chronographed. Any comments - thank you.
  

Jimsan
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Premod70
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Re: 40/65
Reply #24 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 4:02pm
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Any modification I do to cases I do in lots of ten and test them against a standard lot before I go whole hog and possibly ruin my full batch of brass. You'll probab,y find out a certian make of primer matters more than the size of the hole but never will you know until you try, good luck.
  
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Jimsan
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Re: 40/65
Reply #25 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 4:50pm
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10 it is then. Thanks.......Jimsan
  

Jimsan
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gunlaker
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Re: 40/65
Reply #26 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 6:48pm
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Honestly I wouldn't mess with it until you've developed a load with standard hole sizes.  My loads all have excellent velocity statistics with standard sized holes.  I almost always compress my powder a fair bit too.  There is a lot of misinformation on the internet.  The "Swiss powder doesn't like compression" is a classic one you'll run into for example.
 
I have a lot of these rifles.  One of them is a .45-2.6" Sharps that came with a pile of brass that had all of it's flash holes reduced in diameter.  It's velocity stats are the same as all of my other rifles.  If you can get ten shot groups with SD's in the 4.0 fps or lower you will be competitive for any distance that rifle is good for. 

Not to say that messing with different flash hole sizes is not an interesting experiment, as it's all interesting.

Chris.
  
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beltfed
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Re: 40/65
Reply #27 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 9:10pm
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Oakdale,
The target with the 40-65 rounds pictured was from 100yds.
I did have a scope on the rifle.
Macktruckfarm: The brass here was formed from WW 45-70.
WITH STANDARD FLASH HOLES....
In fact, I seat the Fed 150 LP primers thru target paper
to form a wad in the primer pocket. 
BP, even compressed is better off with a "soft"primer.
Modern LP primers have too much power. Can start the 
"plug" of BP and push the bullet prematurely. Not good.
So why open flash holes thinking you need more flame
from the primers.
Early on, in the modern BPCR era, lots of persons were
even using Magnum LR primers. But we have "graduated"
largely to LP primers, and Std Flash holes.
beltfed/arnie
  
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MikeT
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Re: 40/65
Reply #28 - Mar 27th, 2020 at 10:40pm
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At one time, many years ago, I drilled out my 40-65 and 40-50 SBN cases, based on a book I read.  That didn't make any improvement.  Next the idea of the month was to swag the primer holes down to 1/16".  That was done on my 40-82 and 40-65.  That did nothing but make it extremely difficult to de-prime brass with a standard 1/16" pin.

So in the end, I drilled out all my brass to standard specs and the world was simple again.  The primers can make a large difference in how a given load shoots.

Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT
  
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critter68
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Re: 40/65
Reply #29 - Mar 28th, 2020 at 7:33am
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are there any special circumstances/problems/considerations when using a pistol primer in a rifle load such as this 40/65 loading example? thanks
  

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