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What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts (Read 7556 times)

burntwater Oldtimer Offline Posts: 602 Location: Michigan Joined: Feb 5^th, 2018	What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Dec 27^th, 2019 at 3:57pm	Print Post
	I’m a long time shooter, loader and crank but until now I’ve been peeping and not talking. In the early 90’s I was a member thinking I was going to pony up for a rifle and jump into this fascinating game but my profession got in the way. I’m back and this time I going to jump in one way or the other. So I’m seriously spitballing here about the 444 Marlin. I’ve got a rather special rifle and I’m thinking I’d like to work up some cast loads and see if this great straight wall case can offer more than hard hitting lever gun hunting performance. As most of you know this cartridge has been basically pigeonholed to lever gun mid-range deer type hunting so those bullets available are either round or flat point and loads developed are pretty much just for these guns. For some reason Bill Ruger refused to chamber the 444 in his #1’s & #3’s and despite some rumors the problem remains. So there are no readily available single shot 444 rifles that I know of. Well I’ve got a nice one and want to see if I can work up some accurate loads with cast bullets moving around 13-1500 FPS. I’ve got years of experience loading, lots of powder, presses and lead so this Winter I think this sounds like fun. I realize it’s a bit heavy for your offhand matches but I am looking to see just what this nice case can do at slower speeds with cast bullets and hoping it will be interesting if not productive. Looking for insights and suggestions . Regards Rick


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GT Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2370 Location: Northeast Wyoming Joined: Jun 28^th, 2015	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #1 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 4:54pm	Print Post
	Rick, I have a Navy Arms rolling block in this cartridge- very similar to what Paul Matthews talked about in some of his early books. It's a 429 diameter and the largest mold I have for it throws a 300 grain flat nose. I don't recall my load exactly but it's a full case of 2f and at 400 yards it rings a ten inch gong when I do my part. I've recently loaded a few with smokeless but haven't had a chance to try them. This rifle for me is more of a novelty so I doubt I'll spend much time with it. Good luck with it and hope to see more from you on it. Greg

	"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk" T. A. Edison "The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right" M.T.
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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18078 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #2 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 5:48pm	Print Post
	A friend of mine built up a full sized Martini action with a .429" barrel chambered for the .444 Marlin. We shot it at 250-300 yds. using .44 cast bullets and it is extremely accurate. I see no reason why the .444 would not be a great caliber for a single shot, and able to shoot long range with the right twist rate, and bullet. I think the biggest challenge will be trying to get a barrel in .429" with the right twist rate to get maximum performance and accuracy.

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Jeff Houck Junior Member Offline Posts: 78 Location: Pocatello Joined: Jan 11^th, 2014	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #3 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 5:51pm	Print Post
	Is it a Marlin lever gun? If so it has a 1 in 38 twist which will only handle short bullets at the low velocity you want. Have fun working up some loads and keep us posted.

	Jeff Houck
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Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1310 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #4 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 6:30pm	Print Post
	Check with Accurate Molds. There are a number molds designed for single shots up to and over 400 grains. The 444 is not all that uncommon with the Contender crowd. At one time I had a Browning Low Wall in 44 magnum and that is where the mold came from that I used. As long as you match twist rate and powder, no reason it can't be MOA or better. (You need to *Login* or *Register* to view media files and links)


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burntwater Oldtimer Offline Posts: 602 Location: Michigan Joined: Feb 5^th, 2018	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #5 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 6:31pm	Print Post
	The rifle is a custom Parker Ackley #3 Ruger. My brother who knew the man through a family member who needed an Elk guide prevailed upon Ackley to make 444 barrels then a custom rifle for him. I have the rifle now he’s gone. With heavy loads of H322 or H355 and 300 gr Barnes jacketed bullets it is a very accurate piece. Barrel is 25” 1:17” with .427” groove dia. It is seven wide grooves with very narrow deep landes. Gun was made in the early 70’s when the #3 was released. I was told the gun handled heavy hard cast gas checked bullets very well and took its share of elk and muleys. Good .429 heavy jacketed bullets were not available in Wyoming at the time. So I have the rifle and it nicely stocked by one of Ackley‘s people and is easy to shoot. I need to find a good mold or two and work up some moderately light loads so I can squeeze this case for it’s potential. I believe this barrel has the right stuff to get a good look over the edge. if it’s not there I still have a great hunting rifle. Need a chronograph as mine was stolen during my last move. Thanks


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Jeff Houck Junior Member Offline Posts: 78 Location: Pocatello Joined: Jan 11^th, 2014	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #6 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 6:55pm	Print Post
	Beautiful #1! With the 1/17 twist you've goy one fine "modern" 44 cal. BP rifle. It will handle 400ish gr. bullets just fine.

	Jeff Houck
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beltfed Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1826 Location: Central Wi Joined: Dec 20^th, 2007	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #7 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 9:49pm	Print Post
	Jeff H, Marlin later changed the twist on their 444 rifles to a faster twist beltfed/arnie


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Jeff Houck Junior Member Offline Posts: 78 Location: Pocatello Joined: Jan 11^th, 2014	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #8 - Dec 27^th, 2019 at 10:36pm	Print Post
	I didn't know that, thanks. I have an early 336 in 44 mag. with the 1/38 twist and it doesn't like anything heavier than a 250gr.

	Jeff Houck
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GrumpyBear Full Member Offline Posts: 139 Location: Western,Pa. Joined: Sep 30^th, 2017	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #9 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 8:33am	Print Post
	I have one of my Marlin 444's (1977) that I shoot heavy cast in,310 grain laser cast wfn bullets,with a very healthy dose of H4198. Very accurate when I do my part.

	Μολὼν λαβέ Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you. Shash-yazhi -bear-cub Brian
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Deadeye Bly Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1146 Location: Stephens City Joined: Feb 25^th, 2011	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #10 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 9:26am	Print Post
	What you have is pretty much a modern 40/60 Maynard. The 1873 Maynard shot .424" diameter bullets but the later 1882 reduced the bullet diameter to .416". The case length is 2.20" in the Maynard compared to 2.225" in the Marlin. With a fast twist 16"-17" range you should be able to shoot bullets up to about 400 grains in weight.


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DWT1885 Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 468 Location: New Jersey Joined: Nov 25^th, 2010	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #11 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 9:48am	Print Post
	burntwater, Got to tell ya, that is one beautiful Ruger. Dale.

	35th Security Police Squadron, Phan Rang AB, RVN, May 70-71. All gave some, some gave all.
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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18078 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #12 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 10:52am	Print Post
	ssdave wrote on Dec 27^th, 2019 at 11:44pm: Another interesting wildcat would be the 9.3x74R case necked up to .44. Would add capacity for a heavy single shot big game rifle. I think it could be chambered and sized with the .444 reamer and dies, with some careful modifications. Dave, wouldn't that make for an awfully thin case neck bumping a 9.3x74R up to .44? I bump them up to .410" for my .40-85 Ballard and they're pretty thin at that.

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burntwater Oldtimer Offline Posts: 602 Location: Michigan Joined: Feb 5^th, 2018	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #13 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 11:12am	Print Post
	I think it should be fun playing around with load and bullet development but it may get a bit costly as off the shelf cast bullets seem limited to hard cast GC 44 mag types none of which offer spitzer or like noses. Im going work with AA 2015 which has always performed for me in larger straight cases and my 222. But Im going to need to get a mold so I need to research bullet designs. I can’t afford another slippery slope with molds. One is never enough and since I haven’t found anybody else out front breaking ground the slope is a threat. If anybody can point me in the right bullet design direction for this rifle I’m all ears. Thanks Dale for your comments. I’ve had this rifle since the early 80’s and hunted with it quite a bit. Two moose and three elk all of which piled up with broken down shoulders. The bullets are easy on meat but hard on bones. Off the bench a full case of H335 under a Barnes 300 grain ‘Original’ (2250 FPS ) is a shoulder full with the steel Neidner butt plate. Me and this rifle are going to slow down and take a walk in the accuracy game in the future. It won’t be my entry rifle into Schuetzen but I’m working on that too Regards


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CW Oldtimer Offline Posts: 534 Joined: Feb 20^th, 2018	Re: What About The 444 ? Any Thoughts Reply #14 - Dec 28^th, 2019 at 11:24am	Print Post
	That is one of the nicer #3 makeovers I have seen. Very nice! I would be happy if my #3 rebuild turns out half that good looking. -CW Sorry I am not much help with the 444. Never had one but I am sure it could even be a good BPCR with the right bullet.


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