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Alloy Percentages (Read 27349 times)

Dellet Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1301 Joined: May 19^th, 2017	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #15 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 12:24pm	Print Post
	Schuetzenmiester wrote on Feb 18^th, 2019 at 3:34am: My Stevens Pope .33-47 shoots slightly better with 20 than 30. The 30 did not show 250 potential. I don't have any precise numbers any more. The shooting was done over 25 years ago. Interestingly, after the lube has dried for a year or longer, the 30 improves enough it seems to shoot as well as the 20. That is a casual observation. I have not tested 20 against 30 using year old bullets. In this case wouldn't the lead in the bullets also have hardened a fair amount?


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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7650 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #16 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 12:34pm	Print Post
	Dellet, Lead/tin alloys are suppose to soften a little with age. Antimony and arsenic/lead alloy are the ones that harden with age. Frank

	ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
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oneatatime Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4465 Location: Rocky Mountains Joined: Oct 30^th, 2011	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #17 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 1:10pm	Print Post
	I did test alloys with my 40-65 Browning for BPCR. 25 to 1 shot much better than 30 to 1 and 20 to 1 shot better than 25 to 1. I use 20 to 1 for all my bullets except for my long nosed 38-50 bullets which required me to go to 16 to 1 and for my high speed 22 bullets for which I use linotype.


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #18 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 1:20pm	Print Post
	Calculate your bullets RPM's ( Muzzle Velocity X Your Twist Rate X 60 to get your bullets RPM's ) After having done that it's easy to see how any amount of nose slump ( and now an unblanced bullet ) can have ill effects to your accuracy. Think of it as being the same as an unbalanced drive line and or a tire and wheel possibly making it a bit easier to understand what the actual ill effects would be.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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calledflyer Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3963 Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #19 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 1:29pm	Print Post
	No proof in any of this. Joe B. where are you when we need you? Good question Myers. Not too many good answers.
	« Last Edit: Feb 18^th, 2019 at 1:37pm by calledflyer »

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John Boy Ex Member	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #20 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 1:42pm	Print Post
	Dan T's recommended PP Money bullet alloy is what he calls the "three-seven alloy". It is 3 parts Lyman #2 and 7 parts pure lead. Makeup is 97/1.5/1.5 and is 8.2 Bhn when cast. After 18 hours, it stabilizes at 9.8 Bhn and stays for a long time.


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John Boy Ex Member	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #21 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 2:17pm	Print Post
	myers - to find Dan's article - would take some time and effort to find it from all my BPCR News issues. Here's some additional information on the subject though ... (You need to *Login* or *Register* to view media files and links)


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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 18036 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #22 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 2:31pm	Print Post
	I hope Barry does respond here, as I've never gotten a response from anyone explaining how they caught bullets and did not deform them at least some small amount. Seems like any deformation at all caused by catching a bullet would negate any attempts to accurately measure bullet nose slump.

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oneatatime Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4465 Location: Rocky Mountains Joined: Oct 30^th, 2011	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #23 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 2:59pm	Print Post
	You don't have to measure the slump to see its effects. Shooting 20 to 1 in my 38-50 some odd flyers would occur. I read about the nose slump thing and changed to 16 to 1 and no more odd flyers.


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Schuetzenmiester Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 6707 Location: Cool Wet Side of WA Joined: Apr 27^th, 2008	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #24 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 4:27pm	Print Post
	oneatatime wrote on Feb 18^th, 2019 at 2:59pm: You don't have to measure the slump to see its effects. Shooting 20 to 1 in my 38-50 some odd flyers would occur. I read about the nose slump thing and changed to 16 to 1 and no more odd flyers. What distance do you start seeing flyers?

	"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
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Schuetzenmiester Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 6707 Location: Cool Wet Side of WA Joined: Apr 27^th, 2008	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #25 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 4:35pm	Print Post
	Dellet wrote on Feb 18^th, 2019 at 12:24pm: Schuetzenmiester wrote on Feb 18^th, 2019 at 3:34am: My Stevens Pope .33-47 shoots slightly better with 20 than 30. The 30 did not show 250 potential. I don't have any precise numbers any more. The shooting was done over 25 years ago. Interestingly, after the lube has dried for a year or longer, the 30 improves enough it seems to shoot as well as the 20. That is a casual observation. I have not tested 20 against 30 using year old bullets. In this case wouldn't the lead in the bullets also have hardened a fair amount? It has been a while since I read Jacketed Performance with Lead Bullets by Verle Smith, but as I recall, lead tin alloys are very stable after minute changes. I'm at a loss to explain why there should be an improvement in the 30:1 over time.

	"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
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John Boy Ex Member	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #26 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 5:05pm	Print Post
	Myers ... You Owe, looking back in 9 years of BPCR New Issues, Winter 2010, Issue 72, Dan's article ... A Surprising Alloy Test Result -
	« Last Edit: Feb 18^th, 2019 at 5:24pm by »

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oneatatime Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4465 Location: Rocky Mountains Joined: Oct 30^th, 2011	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #27 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 5:13pm	Print Post
	SM, 500 meters.


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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #28 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 6:07pm	Print Post
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	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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JS47 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1265 Location: Arizona Joined: Oct 12^th, 2012	Re: Alloy Percentages Reply #29 - Feb 18^th, 2019 at 6:47pm	Print Post
	marlinguy wrote on Feb 18^th, 2019 at 2:31pm: I hope Barry does respond here, as I've never gotten a response from anyone explaining how they caught bullets and did not deform them at least some small amount. Seems like any deformation at all caused by catching a bullet would negate any attempts to accurately measure bullet nose slump. Shooting into a snow bank seems to work very well. Depending on the snow, velocity, etc. the bullets travel 3 or 4 feet. The downside is I have to wait until spring to find the bullets. The other downside is that there isn't any snow here in Southern Arizona. JS


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