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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360) (Read 13251 times)
marlinguy
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #15 - Nov 8th, 2018 at 10:01am
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I'm really glad mine is the 9.5 instead of the 9.3. I use my .38-55 dies to load it, and run .38-55 bullets through my Lyman sizer to make them .376" diameter. I trim the .38-55 brass 1/10" approx.
  

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Smokepole50
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #16 - Nov 8th, 2018 at 1:39pm
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I bought two boxes of Starline 38-55 brass (100) rds based on reading someone's post about it being just a tad short for the 9.3x57R but shot fine. After getting it and doing chamber a cast on my 33 I find that the back of my chamber is considerably larger at the case web area. Large enough that I switched to x72R cases which are .010 larger at the case web. I really don't want a case head separation in any roller much less the Husky 33 that's 100 plus years old.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #17 - Nov 8th, 2018 at 6:06pm
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My measurements showed the 9.3 to only be .006" larger at the base diameter above the rim. I've had no issues with .38-55 brass in mine. But mine seems to be an oddball at 9.5mm, so maybe it's different than those that are 9.3mm?
  

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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #18 - Nov 9th, 2018 at 4:01pm
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I measured 38-55 Win brass vs Norma 9.3x72R in front of the rim and got .010 but that is not that significant. If you shoot modern 7x57 in a 1902 Roller you will probably get more expansion than that and the brass won't separate even at those higher pressures. I used to take a wrap of electrical tape around the base of 7x57 brass before firing in the 1902. This centered the brass and made an even bulge on the first shot and then you could take the tape off and have brass that was concentric to the chamber.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #19 - Nov 9th, 2018 at 5:02pm
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The rim on the .38-55 brass fits the chamber cut nicely on my gun, so it doesn't need centering like a rebated rim might.
  

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Smokepole50
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #20 - Nov 9th, 2018 at 7:57pm
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Well once I get a warm and fuzzy load worked up with the X72 brass I might transfer it to the [100] 38-55 cases I have.


After doing all the Pressure Trace work with smokeless and the 8x58RD cartridge I'm just a bit concerned about the strength of this baby roller. I really don't want to die just to say I shot a obsolete cartridge in a 120 yr old rifle.
« Last Edit: Nov 9th, 2018 at 8:03pm by Smokepole50 »  
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marlinguy
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #21 - Nov 9th, 2018 at 11:30pm
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They're a very strong action. I wouldn't hotrod them to push maximum loads. But no issue with a load leaving the barrel under 1500 fps. 
The little #2 Rolling Block is even smaller and they were chambered in cartridges like .38-40 and .32-20, which can be pretty hot in some factory loads.
  

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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #22 - Nov 10th, 2018 at 1:13am
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I have a request in to the Husqvarna museum for any information they might come up with on what was being shot in these back when as far as bullet weight and achieved velocities. We'll see if they can scare up anything.
  
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svartkruttgris#369
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #23 - Nov 10th, 2018 at 10:35am
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National Library of Sweden (Kungliga Biblioteket) might be another place to inquire. I got some original Department of Defense reports about 8X58RD chambered rollers there. Often material one might expect to find elsewhere in Sweden has been moved to KB, which happened with reports I got. 

Best with such old, Swedish only reports if correspondence is in Swedish, at least in part. Staff in KB are very helpful and English capable, BUT, they usually need some Swedish-language text, names, terminology, etc. to focus their searching. I can probably help.

I would not be surprised if you end up getting referred to Norma, or at least to old loading data for cartridges for which M33 was chambered. Do any USA Husqvarna collectors have old Norma loading manuals, tech info about loads, etc.??

About same time I was seeking data for 8X58RD, I had a few email exchanges with person(s) in Eskilstuna about 8X58RD loads for 8X58RD rollers, however, they were not aware of the Dept of Defense reports I found.Will see IF I still have working email addy(s) or names. Who knows what they might be able to provide.

Here is some info about online seaching in KB collections.
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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #24 - Nov 10th, 2018 at 10:59am
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Thanks for the info, SK. I have just contacted Norma to see what they can provide.
  
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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #25 - Dec 10th, 2018 at 11:08am
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The Husqvarna Museum had no ammunition information and I never got anything back from Norma. I'm taking the chronograph to the range today so I'll have some data.
  
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Swede
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #26 - Dec 10th, 2018 at 11:36am
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Here are some old Swedish information from 1886
  
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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #27 - Dec 10th, 2018 at 11:57am
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Wow, thank you Swede. It will take me a while to get it all translated but I think I pulled out a grooved? heavy bullet, 231 grains, for target shooting and a smooth light bullet, 177 grains, for birds and using 50 to 54 grains of powder (black). The bullets were cast of 95 parts lead, 4 parts tin and 1 part antimony.
« Last Edit: Dec 10th, 2018 at 12:48pm by oneatatime »  
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svartkruttgris#369
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #28 - Dec 10th, 2018 at 3:23pm
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oneatatime wrote on Dec 10th, 2018 at 11:57am:
Wow, thank you Swede. It will take me a while to get it all translated but I think I pulled out a grooved? heavy bullet, 231 grains, for target shooting and a smooth light bullet, 177 grains, for birds and using 50 to 54 grains of powder (black). The bullets were cast of 95 parts lead, 4 parts tin and 1 part antimony.


Good first cut at translation! Small corrections added in my translations: 1) heavy target bullet (15 grams) is of "soft lead" and has lube (tallow) grooves. 2) light (11,5 grams) bird bullet has Pb alloy as you translate. Express bullet is for medium large animals and same weight as bird bullet -- these bullets were exclusively made by Husqvarna and can be ordered.
« Last Edit: Dec 10th, 2018 at 9:55pm by svartkruttgris#369 »  
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oneatatime
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Re: Making brass for the 9.3x57R (360)
Reply #29 - Dec 10th, 2018 at 6:43pm
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As you can tell from the above posts it is most like a "38-55 lite". That will influence my next round of testing. For today I had lighter loads in the 32-40 ballpark to ease into it but with a 196 grain bullet which would fall in between the factory 177 to 231 grains. I used 4 different powders (4227, R7, 4759 and 4198), and 3 5-shot loads with each varying by about .5 grains. The sights are 3 leaves with very fine Vs and a pyramidal front. These sights are not kind to my eyes (I'm scheduled for cataract surgery) but I thought I could get some idea of how it might shoot before I sprang for a tang sight and a globe front like I put on my other 33. The leaves are marked 60, 120, and 180 (meters). Not knowing how it would take to my test loads I opted for 50 yards and the 60 meter leaf. As it turned out this barely worked as it was shooting 8 to 12 inches high at this distance for most of the loads. I'm glad I took the chrono as it showed extreme ES for some of the powders which I will attribute to too light loads not allowing them to burn consistently. It also showed that the high ends of some of the loads, say those few that popped up in the 1400-1450 fps range were getting much closer to the point of aim. I'm going to guess that the sights will be on at 1500 to 1600 fps. However, all of today's loads were much slower.  The only powder that was happy with this was good old 4759 all three of its loads (avg fps of 986, 1006 and 1034) were consistent on the target, but 9 inches high, and the last put 3 shots in a cloverleaf and the other 2 opened the group to 1.1 inch.
« Last Edit: Dec 11th, 2018 at 1:29pm by oneatatime »  
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