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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker (Read 32973 times)
marlinguy
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #120 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 3:19pm
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Redsetter wrote on Oct 29th, 2018 at 2:48pm:
uscra112 wrote on Oct 29th, 2018 at 1:42pm:
Rapid growth can lead to chaotic organization.  A glance at Tesla is all you need for proof.

I've long believed that Page grew the company on borrowed money, so when Westinghouse wanted a plant, all they had to do was talk to his lenders.  Saw this happen to a entrepreneurial friend/mentor when I was in my '20s. 


Money can be borrowed, but where did Stevens find so many skilled workers so quickly:  from 150 in 1898 to 900 in 1901!  
Doesn't seem possible that many could simply be hired away from all the other gun makers & machine shops in the area.


It was gun rich NE United States, and several companies had gone into recent bankruptcy around that time. Whitney went under and was purchased by Winchester around 1889. Winchester dissolved of all equipment and manpower. Bullard went out later in the 1890's also. Harrington & Richardson/Wesson went under in 1898. 
The skilled gun craftsmen of the NE were plentiful, and I think Stevens had no problem find them with the number of smaller companies going belly up.
  

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Redsetter
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #121 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 4:11pm
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BP wrote on Oct 29th, 2018 at 2:55pm:


How many versions of catalog #50 are we up to?
How many versions of catalog #51 are we up to?
How many versions of catalog #52 are we up to?
And  how many versions of catalog #53 are we up to? 


Haven't kept up with 50, but 2 at least 51s, 4 52s (but that was over 4 yrs), 2 at least 53s, & 2 at least 54s.

  
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BP
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #122 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 4:30pm
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Three different #50's?
A 1902 date on the spine of one, and two more #50's with the 1903 date on the front cover (one near the top, and the other near the bottom) ?
  

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Bill Lawrence
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #123 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 7:48pm
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Okay, BP, I'm gonna try to summarize the catalogs we've hashed over so far:

Catalog # 50; R$R; 1902
Catalog # 50; Cornell; very late 1902/very early 1903
Catalog # 51; Cornell; early 1903 (likely incorrectly dated 1905; see my note)
Catalog # 51; original; late 1903
Catalog # 52; Cornell; 1907
Catalog # 52; Cornell; 1909 (but likely 1910 due to M 404 & High Power lever guns both being in the catalog)
Catalog # 53; original; 1911
Catalog # 53; original; hand-dated 1912

Cope claims four (4) Catalog # 52 editions, 1907-1910; Grant incompletely backs this up by stating that the catalog that introduces the M 404 and the High Power guns is a # 52.

We have no catalogs attributed to 1904-1906.  Three years is too long to go without a catalog, especially at Stevens' exhibited frenzied pace.  Therefore, the catalogs falling in that "hole" might all be # 51s, if we take Cope as gospel; or they might be a mix of # 51s and # 52s.

Finally, though my tired brain and eyes have tried mightily, I can't find any references in the discussion so far of Catalog # 54.

Bill Lawrence
  
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oneatatime
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #124 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 8:22pm
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OK. Just received Cornell #1578 listed as #50 1903 146 pages. The highest numbered page is 128 and even if you count both sides of the front and back covers and the unnumbered pages (other than what would be 1 and 2 which precede the numbered 3) there are only 8 more so 136 would be the count in that case. Other than the 1903 on the cover there is no date inside later than several 1902s. The only mention of the 44 1/2 is found on page 25 under Rifles - Model - Ideal - No. 44 in the ammunition section which lists only RFs and the 25-20 and 32-20 CFs with the sentence "For special calibres and extras see description of our No. 44 1/2 rifle, which has an entirely new action." Said description is not to be found in this catalog. Models 45 and up (except 55 the "Lady Model") are still available in anything up through 38-55 and 44-40. Interesting tidbits abound in the catalog such as Models 49 and 51 are tested in a rest at 200 and 10 shots must fall in 4 inches - Model 52 3 3/4 inches and Model 54 3 1/2 inches. With Pope barrels this is reduced to 3 1/2 for 25s, 3 for 28s, and 2 1/2 for larger. Plated actions, levers, and butt plates ran $2.50 for nickel, $4.00 for silver, and $15.00 for gold. Barrel weights varied from 3 1/4 pounds for a 24 inch #1 to 11 1/2 pounds for a 34 inch #5. They would rebarrel your Ballard, Borchardt, Remington or Winchester single for $12 to $17 depending on barrel weight. Having your Stevens hammer fitted with a set screw to control sear engagement was $1. The cartridge section is quite interesting for example for the 25-20 Stevens CF the 86 grain bullet is recommended for target shooting up to 200 yards, the 57 and 77 grainers or the 73 sharp pointed or 75 hollow point for hunting. There is also a list of the twists used in all their barrels.
  
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Redsetter
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #125 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 9:24pm
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Bill Lawrence wrote on Oct 29th, 2018 at 7:48pm:
I can't find any references in the discussion so far of Catalog # 54.


No, I mentioned that because Cope listed two: one 1914--the LAST one from Stevens "Golden Age," & very surprisingly, a 2nd ed. in 1919.  I've got the 1914--not much different from #53--but I'd be much more interested in seeing what Stevens had to sell after Wilson's War.
  
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #126 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 9:51pm
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I've just written Cornell about the page numbers discrepancy and noted that in looking at their website page on this catalog noticed that in the Contents - Index list they showed not only the 44 1/2 but also the English Model 044 1/2 which is not mentioned anywhere in the 128 pages. I'll bet there must have been an insert which they had and counted in the pages but which did not get included in the catalog. We'll see what Abby says.
  
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #127 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 11:30pm
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Oneatatime, based on my experience with Abby, she'll probably figuratively take your head off.

Red, I know I have the 1911 Catalog # 53 and likely the 1914 Catalog # 54 and at least one and maybe two other "Golden Age" issues.  Unfortunately, those and my post-WWI ephemera are in storage in my  way-off-site warehouse.  But as I wrote before, I will go dig them out if necessary.

Bill Lawrence
  
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #128 - Oct 29th, 2018 at 11:46pm
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I've never had anything but the most cordial relationship with Abby and Rob, over something north of ten years now.
  

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Bill Lawrence
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Re: Interesting Stevens 44 22 LR on Gunbroker
Reply #129 - Oct 30th, 2018 at 11:56am
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I've never had anything but the most cordial relationship with Abby and Rob, over something north of ten years now.

Unfortunately, I had the gall to legitimately but I thought constructively and in only a small way criticize the quality and correctness of "her" publications.  My fault, obviously.

Bill Lawrence
  
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