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marlinguy
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Lyman M Die question
Sep 15th, 2017 at 8:56pm
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Went to Lyman's site to look at ordering M die expander plugs, but they didn't list any. Sent them a email question, and they got back telling me to call to find sizes and prices. 
Did a little searching on the internet, and pictures I see have me confused now? (easy to do!) My Long/Short M ides use expander plugs that have a male stud to mount them that's 10-32 thread. But pictures of the M die plugs all seem to have some larger base with no threaded stud?
Are the expanders different now, or are they two piece now and the expander plug threads into this weird looking base?

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Mine looks like the plug part on the right, but with the 10-32 stud, not that larger body in this picture.
  
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Jeff Houck
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #1 - Sep 15th, 2017 at 9:12pm
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The M die part you have pictured is meant for a Lee die. It is an insert that drops into their "universal" die body. A nice way to do things. 

The M die part that is threaded with the 10/32 thread fits the Lyman die body.
  
Jeff Houck
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craigd
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #2 - Sep 15th, 2017 at 11:51pm
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I think Jeff is right. The picture that you are showing may have been taken off the NOE website. As an aside, those expander inserts that you show are attractively priced, along with others like track of the wolf offers.
  
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uscra112
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #3 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 7:00am
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McMaster has 9/16-18 all-thread rod from which I make my own solid mandrels for the M-die.   Lyman rarely seems to have the exact size that I need to get the right bullet fit in the case.

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Phil

BTW I recently bought on of those Lee dies.  The plug has too much taper to do anything but flare an already sized case. 

  
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marlinguy
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #4 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 8:31am
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The one Joe pictured is like mine! I guess I'll call Lyman Monday and see what they have. I'm expanding those .303 British to make my .40-50SS and I need a few more expander plugs in sizes between .358" and .412" so I don't lose any cases. Tried pushing the steps in larger jumps and lost 5-6 already, so stopping until I get some in between sizes.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #5 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 8:35am
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uscra112 wrote on Sep 16th, 2017 at 7:00am:
McMaster has 9/16-18 all-thread rod from which I make my own solid mandrels for the M-die.   Lyman rarely seems to have the exact size that I need to get the right bullet fit in the case.

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Phil

BTW I recently bought on of those Lee dies.  The plug has too much taper to do anything but flare an already sized case. 



I have plenty of rod stock, but I'd rather turn down a close size than start from scratch. I'm not too concerned about what sizes they have until I reach the final expansion and need it to be correct for the bullet and chamber.
The Lee Universal Expanders are worthless for this work. As you mentioned, they're too tapered. Might be fine for belling case mouths.
  
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uscra112
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #6 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 9:51am
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Something I've done to make large increases in mouth size is to use the decapper stems from Lee dies.  They have a long taper, are easy to machine to a smaller size if necessary.  One flaw in them is that the collet nut that holds them in the die doesn't, so I've got a handful of new collet nuts, too.  Once I get a setup I tack-weld the stem to the nut.   

Phil
  
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John Boy
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #7 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 11:43am
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Don't believe the expander plug picture is TOTF which I have a whole box of them ...
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Yours - 
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jy3855
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #8 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 12:04pm
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Vall,

The NOE mouth expanders are a nice tool, and the only reason that I bought a Lee Universal Expanding die in which to use them. I have one of the NOE expanders for my 1893 TD in 30-30, as the groove diameter of that rifle is .305" and NOE makes an expander that works for that bullet diameter.

Here's page 1 of 3 pages of the NOE expanders in a variety of sizes from 17 to 45 calibers: (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links);

A nice thing about the NOE neck expanders is that they have the 2-step expander like the Lyman M dies and the RCBS Cowboy die set expanders.
  
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craigd
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #9 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 12:38pm
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jy3855 wrote on Sep 16th, 2017 at 12:04pm:
....The NOE mouth expanders are a nice tool, and the only reason that I bought a Lee Universal Expanding die in which to use them....

I'd tend to agree with this. The Lee expander, to me, has very limited use. I've never used them. But, the Lee expander die body is what those NOE expanders were turned to fit. 

I'm pretty sure a Lee body with a NOE expander insert can be purchased for the cost of just the Lyman expander tip. I have two M dies, but several of the Lee/NOE setup. They are inexpensive enough for me to dedicate a setup to a set of dies that need them, and have a couple extra die bodies on hand for occasional use. 

I like to have a few slightly different sizes of the NOE expanders on hand. I haven't had to do it yet, but I also have three of the TOTW inserts that I can use as is, but mainly I'm saving them to turn a size I don't have if I'm in a pinch.

It's completely unrelated, but I've thought NOE should consider making a series of neck sizing bushings to fit the Lee die body.
  
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Chuckster
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #10 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 1:09pm
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New expanders for the Lee die are easy to make with a long taper and work very well.
Do not anneal before expanding or the bottleneck will crush.
Lubricant is critical for expanding cases. Found automotive chassis grease works about the best.
Chuck
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #11 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 9:26pm
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Chuckster wrote on Sep 16th, 2017 at 1:09pm:
New expanders for the Lee die are easy to make with a long taper and work very well.
Do not anneal before expanding or the bottleneck will crush.
Lubricant is critical for expanding cases. Found automotive chassis grease works about the best.
Chuck


That was my mistake Chuck! I thought annealing them first would keep me from losing cases to splitting, but it made the shoulder collapse.
I wont be buying a Lee universal, as I have both Lyman Short and Long M dies, plus about 18 expander plugs. No need to head down another path at this point.
  
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #12 - Sep 17th, 2017 at 8:38am
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Marlinguy
Found this


Lyman M die Rifle expanding plugs
Plug 1st 2nd Bullet dia
22R .222 .225 .222 .226 P/N 7129055 (22R Short)
24R .242 .246 .243 .244
25R .255 .259 .256 .257
26R .262 .266 .263 .265 P/N 7129059
27R .276 .280 .277 .279
28R .282 .286 .283 .285
30R .307 .311 .308 .310 P/N 7129101
31R .310 .314 .311 .313 P/N 7129064 (31R Short)
31AR .318 .322 .319 .321
32R .320 .324 .321 .323 P/N 7129065
33R .337 .341 .338 .340
35R .357 .361 .358 .360
37R .374 .378 .375 .377
41R .407 .412 .408 .411 (40-65, thanx to EDG)
43R unknown, (reported by Guesser)
45R .455 .459 .456 .458 P/N 7129078
50R (50-70)

Lyman M die Pistol expanding plugs
Plug 1st 2nd Bullet dias
25AP .249 .253 .251 --
30P .307 .311 .308 .310
32AP .310 .314 .311 .313
32P .313 .317 .314 .316
38AP .353 .357 .354 .356 P/N 7129050
38P .356 .360 .357 .359
10MM .398 .402 .399 .401
10MM .408 .412 .409 .411 (typo???)
41P (41 Rem Mag) (useable w/40-65)
44MP .427 .431 .428 .430
45AP .450 .454 .451 .453 P/N 7129051
45P .453 .457 .454 .456
  
Bob  NRA Life Benefactor
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marlinguy
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #13 - Sep 17th, 2017 at 11:15am
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Thanks Bullshot! Very surprised to see the .37R sizes don't go larger than .378" since most .38-55 are at least .378" and often much larger? Would have expected them to go to around .383" with some steps in between .378" and .383".
  
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jy3855
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Re: Lyman M Die question
Reply #14 - Sep 17th, 2017 at 12:00pm
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I was under the impression that the sizing plugs were no longer for sale individually, that you have to buy a whole M die? Is this not the case?

I bought a whole new die for my 25-20. Sure would like to be able to purchase only the expander plug.
  
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