Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 3  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Mystery Schuetzen Rifle? (Read 10933 times)
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4144
Location: Benton  Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #15 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 9:08am
Print Post  
The trigger guard hinges,  he shows it open in the middle photo in the second series.  looked like a friction catch of the stock-wards curl on the lever---a couple pf mine do that too.  My guess is that the little stud in the underside of the wrist at the back of the trigger guard is a lever that if pushed sideways will be a quick release for the DST assembly for cleaning and oiling with very light non clogging oil.   Sperm oil was originally used on precision machining with clock/watch works AND on quality DST.  I clean the ones on my original schuetzens with spray Carburator cleaner and d then lightly lube with auto transmission fluid,  the closest we have to original highly refined sperm-whale oil.

the refinement of the hinged trigger-guard and the (probable JMHO) high grade trigger set make me think that it is of European creation.  If not over there, that built by an old-country 'smith for an experienced old-country shooter
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
frnkeore
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 7249
Location: Central Point, OR 97502
Joined: Jun 16th, 2010
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #16 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 10:53am
Print Post  
I would still be interested in seeing the bottom side of the barrel. It's the only place left that there could be markings.

Frank
  

ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
sharps4590
Junior Member
**
Offline



Posts: 85
Joined: Mar 24th, 2016
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #17 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 2:43pm
Print Post  
Questionable, I'm very, very inclined to agree with all your points.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
2coltkid
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8
Joined: Feb 21st, 2017
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #18 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 10:01pm
Print Post  
OK, here are better photos of the trigger guard, closed and open
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
2coltkid
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8
Joined: Feb 21st, 2017
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #19 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 10:08pm
Print Post  
Pulled the barrel, what a pain in the XXX.  This thing was put together a long time ago and I don't think it was ever dismantled. No markings anywhere! Bummer
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
2coltkid
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8
Joined: Feb 21st, 2017
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #20 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 10:12pm
Print Post  
Now for the trigger questions, more photos
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
2coltkid
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8
Joined: Feb 21st, 2017
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #21 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 10:17pm
Print Post  
one other feature, it has a flip up rear sight.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Pentz
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline


Funf und Zwanzig mit den
Hut

Posts: 415
Location: Vancouver, WA
Joined: Sep 4th, 2014
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #22 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 11:21pm
Print Post  
That is a really interesting rifle.  The rear sight could be a replacement, as the barrel metal appears to be displaced by a too-large site wedge.  Also check under the buttplate for markings.
  

ASSRA Member Yoostabe # 11497
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ballardhepburnmich
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 598
Location: Scotts,mi.
Joined: May 20th, 2015
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #23 - Feb 24th, 2017 at 11:50pm
Print Post  
That was a common way to make a dovetail with a chisel.
Lee
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
sharps4590
Junior Member
**
Offline



Posts: 85
Joined: Mar 24th, 2016
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #24 - Feb 26th, 2017 at 7:43am
Print Post  
Those are typical 2 lever set triggers.  The design was used in German, British and American muzzleloaders and later rifles so for me it doesn't help with where the rifle was made....doggone it.  The rifle may well pre-date 4 lever triggers.  I don't know when they, 4 lever triggers, came on the scene.

Even though you don't know who or where the old piece is still an absolutely wonderful acquisition.  One I would be proud to own.  Again, congrats!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
frnkeore
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 7249
Location: Central Point, OR 97502
Joined: Jun 16th, 2010
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #25 - Feb 26th, 2017 at 12:21pm
Print Post  
A great mystery!
Another take on it, maybe someone, late in there apprenticeship, is the reason that it's not signed. And I think it's a very early cap lock because of the rifling style.

Frank
  

ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
QuestionableMaynard8130
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4144
Location: Benton  Harbor MI
Joined: Apr 17th, 2004
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #26 - Feb 26th, 2017 at 2:20pm
Print Post  
The mix of European and American elements is interesting,   the foreward wood looks "Western American".  The folding leaf sight and the way it was chiseled in rather than tapped into a filed in dovetail; with no provision for an early screw-into-the-breechplug-"tail" looks traditionally "frontier American".  The unmarked barrel itself could go either way (though by that late date manufactured barrels were commonly available)  as could the lock.    
However the butt design, buttplate,  the detachable trigger unit; And especially the hinged trigger guard  (I've never seen one like that on a ML before) certainly give an European taste.       

If it were mine I'd be inclined to remove the barrel again, plug the nipple,  clamp it vertically in a padded vise and soak the bore with Break-Free for a few days warming gently it occasionally with an electric heat gun.  then drain it and try to carefully remove the breech plug to see how secure and solid it is (my basic approach with any New-to me old ML) and then clean and inspect the bore from the breech once it was good and clean (and barring major corrosion) I'd slug the bore and check the twist rate.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
2coltkid
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8
Joined: Feb 21st, 2017
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #27 - Mar 13th, 2017 at 1:55pm
Print Post  
Well, I got a chance to stuff a video scope down the barrel and it looks like it made about 1/3 twist in whole length, so my guess 1;96 twist? Seems a bit odd, NOT MUCH OF A TWIST??  Undecided
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 16009
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #28 - Mar 13th, 2017 at 4:37pm
Print Post  
2coltkid wrote on Mar 13th, 2017 at 1:55pm:
Well, I got a chance to stuff a video scope down the barrel and it looks like it made about 1/3 twist in whole length, so my guess 1;96 twist? Seems a bit odd, NOT MUCH OF A TWIST??  Undecided


No, not much. But probably plenty for a round ball gun.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
beltfed
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1749
Location: Central Wi
Joined: Dec 20th, 2007
Re: Mystery Schuetzen Rifle?
Reply #29 - Mar 13th, 2017 at 6:56pm
Print Post  
Alternatively soak the breechplug area with 50/50 ATF/Acetone
penetrates Very well
beltfed/arnie
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 3 
Send TopicPrint