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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) 22 short (Read 16711 times)
Charliek
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22 short
Dec 4th, 2016 at 4:56pm
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I am almost totally ignorant on the subject of single shot rifles, but I have enjoyed lurking on the site the last few months.  However, at least one issue continues to bother me, and that is the frequent mention of rifles in 22 short.  When I was growing up in the 40s and 50s there still shooting galleries with real rifles and they were Winchester pumps (06?) that were 22 shorts. And some olympic pistols are 22 shorts, but was there a serious use for rifles in that caliber?

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BP
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Re: 22 short
Reply #1 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 5:17pm
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Of course.
Plenty of 22 shorts were and still are used for small game hunting, pest control, and target shooting.
And for revolvers, NAA offers a version of their mini-revolvers in 22 short only.
  

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Redsetter
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Re: 22 short
Reply #2 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 6:16pm
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S&W's first revolver, the 7-shot No. 1 model, which introduced the Short, wasn't sold for any of the purposes mentioned, but rather for self-defense, and carried by some (well-off) soldiers in the Civil War for that purpose.   

  
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Re: 22 short
Reply #3 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 7:43pm
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Redsetter wrote on Dec 4th, 2016 at 6:16pm:
S&W's first revolver, the 7-shot No. 1 model, which introduced the Short, wasn't sold for any of the purposes mentioned, but rather for self-defense, and carried by some (well-off) soldiers in the Civil War for that purpose.  


Yep, pest control.    Wink
  

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marlinguy
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Re: 22 short
Reply #4 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 8:01pm
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A lot of serious target shooters used .22 Short for competition. I knew several shooters in bullseye matches that shot Walther .22 Short because of their lack of recoil for rapidfire stages.
I own a Ballard #6 Schuetzen rebarreled and chambered for .22 Short with a match chamber, done by Zettler Bors. in the late 1800's.
  

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Schutzenbob
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Re: 22 short
Reply #5 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 8:05pm
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Charlie,

This is a pretty typical 22 Short gallery rifle; at 50 and 75 feet it will shoot amazingly well;
« Last Edit: Dec 6th, 2016 at 6:03pm by Schutzenbob »  
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marlinguy
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Re: 22 short
Reply #6 - Dec 4th, 2016 at 8:56pm
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Another plus for .22 Short is how quiet they are in a 30" barrel! My Zettler Ballard sounds like a pellet gun shooting .22 Shorts!
  

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waterman
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Re: 22 short
Reply #7 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:59am
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The heyday of Shorts as wintertime indoor or Gallery Schuetzen was 1875-1915.  Very high scores were posted and a lot of $$ changed hands when wagered.  The highest scores showed up when Shorts were loaded with King's Semi-Smokeless (Peters only, beginning in 1897) and Lesmok (beginning about 1911).

Today's CCI Target Shorts are 93% to 97% as accurate as the old Peters stuff.  That means they are good enough for almost all of us when used at 50 or 75 feet.   

My experience to date with the Rapid Fire Shorts made for pistol competition is that (in a Stevens-Pope) they are not as accurate as CCI Target Shorts.  The bullets are more pointed and I think there are problems with the the way the bullets engage the rifling.  I do not recommend making any extra effort or spending $$ to get the pistol ammo.
  
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: 22 short
Reply #8 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:30am
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the CCI brand (about the only kind currently to be found) makes a target version, a hi-speed (slightly) copper flashed hollow-point that is used a lot by trappers and also makes an excellent squirrel rifle in an appropriate chambered and barreled rifle. 
Rifles dedicated for use with "shorts" usually have a slower rate of twist along with a shorter chamber to accommodate the shorter lighter bullet.   Shorts can be shot in most other 22 rimfire rifles though they may not actuate a semi-auto's repeating mechanism (unless it is one of the 22-short specific rapid-fire competition pistols). And the faster twist may not yield the accuracy potential of a 22-short specific rifle.

  There are also Cee-Bee version which are even lower powered, basically a very light bullet and the priming charge only for propellant. The potential problem with them is that they are so low powered that they may not exit a long or dirty barrel.   I have not experienced that with my german schuetzen 22 short rifle.  They are very quiet. frequently the "plink" of the bullet hitting the bullet trap i use indoors is much louder the the sound of the gun going off. However they are not toys and have enough power to do damage if handled carelessly.   They are very accurate out to 15 or 20 yards or so for offhand practice.

Sadly 22 short competition has lost completely been replaces with "air-guns" now
  

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Re: 22 short
Reply #9 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:11am
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QuestionableMaynard8130 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:30am:
  ...There are also Cee-Bee version which are even lower powered, basically a very light bullet and the priming charge only for propellant. The potential problem with them is that they are so low powered that they may not exit a long or dirty barrel.   I have not experienced that with my german schuetzen 22 short rifle.  They are very quiet. frequently the "plink" of the bullet hitting the bullet trap i use indoors is much louder the the sound of the gun going off. However they are not toys and have enough power to do damage if handled carelessly.   They are very accurate out to 15 or 20 yards or so for offhand practice.


Every summer, to deter the big flocks of Grackles that pillage my bird feeders, I shoot a lot of CBs in a Stevens 44 with a LR chamber.  Despite the long jump the bullet must make to reach the rifling, CB Shorts have proved slightly more accurate than CB Longs (though accuracy of both is pretty marginal even at 25-30 yds.)  Only explanation of the Short's superiority I can think of is more consistent pressure in the smaller case.

The CBs made by CCI DO contain a bit of powder, though I once was given a few German-made CBs that do not; these, I can well believe, might get stuck in the 30" brl. of this Stevens.


  
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Redsetter
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Re: 22 short
Reply #10 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:20am
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waterman wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:59am:
...Today's CCI Target Shorts are 93% to 97% as accurate as the old Peters stuff.  That means they are good enough for almost all of us when used at 50 or 75 feet. 


Ever heard of Shorts being used in 100 yd matches during this same period?  I haven't, and don't believe they were, but this was alleged by someone on the Winchester Collectors forum.
  
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beltfed
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Re: 22 short
Reply #11 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:42am
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I wish I could get more of the Winchester "22 Long CB Match"
cartridges: #X22LRCBMA. Have not found any more of them for a long time.
Have not shot any recently from the one box I have, but I recall they were fairly accurate.
beltfed/arnie
  
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Re: 22 short
Reply #12 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:25pm
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beltfed wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:42am:
I wish I could get more of the Winchester "22 Long CB Match"
cartridges: #X22LRCBMA. Have not found any more of them for a long time.
Have not shot any recently from the one box I have, but I recall they were fairly accurate.
beltfed/arnie


Never knew Winchester made them--in my area, it's even hard to find the CCI brand.   
  
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Lefty38-55
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Re: 22 short
Reply #13 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:45pm
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beltfed wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:42am:
I wish I could get more of the Winchester "22 Long CB Match" cartridges: #X22LRCBMA. Have not found any more of them for a long time.

I think I bought the last case from Meunier a few years ago, for that well campaigned Pope high wall that I posted photos of. One-hole groups at 50' from the 1-in-25" twist barrel. 

Just bought a brick (500) of Aquila 22 Shorts for $30 ... couldn't pass them up! Can't wait to try them out!

FWIW my LGS had MORE 22s IN STOCK (thank you Donald Trump, haha!) last week than I've seen in the last 10-years!
  

All of my single shots shoot one tiny ragged hole with cast bullets ... it's just the following shots that tend to open up my groups Wink ...
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waterman
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Re: 22 short
Reply #14 - Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm
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I tried CCI Target Shorts off the bench at 100 yards, shooting a Stevens-Pope.  Best I could do was to keep everything inside the 18-ring.

I also shot two 30-shot offhand Schuetzen 200-yard matches (max 750 points) with Shorts in a Winder.  My first score was 330.  Next time out it was a 404.  I quit while I was ahead.

At 200 yards, from the bench, the Stevens-Pope put weighed CCI Target Shorts in a string 21" high and 5.5" wide.  I used iron sights because my Unertl does not have enough clicks.

Same routine with a Winder gave groups 30" high and 6" wide.
  
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