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marlinguy
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Ballards may be weaker,
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Gunky Ballard
Sep 14th, 2016 at 11:43pm
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Friend of mine called me this morning, and wanted me to look at a Ballard with him. It was coated with some sort of oil many decades ago, and looked all brown and funky! He decided to pass on it, and after making sure he wasn't going to change his mind, I told him I wanted to buy it. Figured with the perfect .40-85 bore, and almost perfect wood; there might be something good under that gunk! So back to the gun shop and I drug it home.

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After a few minutes rubbing a spot on the barrel with acetone on a rag, to see the caliber; a very nice rust blued barrel showed up! Then a little more rubbing on one side of the receiver, and some decent case colors were revealed!
Gun has a nice old Ballard Long Range vernier sight, and a Ballard combination front sight. Will remove the wood tomorrow, and see what I can do on the rest of the metal!

Barrel clean spot:
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Receiver clean spot:
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« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2016 at 11:48pm by marlinguy »  

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kensmachine
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #1 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 1:13am
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Val that's damn nice who would pass on that ken
  
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Travelor
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #2 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 5:59am
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Very nice.

Bet your friend is kicking himself now.
  
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Joe Do...
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #3 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 7:49am
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All that "gunk" probably help preserve the original finish underneath.  Look at the case color!

Nice find !
  
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marlinguy
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Ballards may be weaker,
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #4 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 9:45am
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kensmachine wrote on Sep 15th, 2016 at 1:13am:
Val that's damn nice who would pass on that ken


I'm sure we both know him Ken. You probably know his face as a regular at OAC, but not a single shot guy. I think he was traumatized when the store raised the price $700 overnight, as he thought he had a deal locked up. I tried to encourage him to buy it, as the long range sight was worth over half what they were asking. He just didn't want to spend that much, and gave me the green light to go for it.
Another fella we both know stuck his nose in the deal, and told the store it was "the nicest Ballard he'd ever seen, and worth $5k!" That nearly killed the deal, and I talked my tail off convincing the store it was NOT a $5k Ballard. Funny part is the guy who gave his input also works at another gun store, and sold a beautiful #4 Ballard for $1100 recently! He was there still, and I asked him why the #4 he sold was $1100, and this one was $5k? He couldn't explain himself, so the store owner realized he might not be the expert he claimed to be.
  

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marlinguy
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #5 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 9:49am
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Joe Do... wrote on Sep 15th, 2016 at 7:49am:
All that "gunk" probably help preserve the original finish underneath.  Look at the case color!

Nice find !

The store owner bought a collection of a dozen old guns, and he said almost all were coated in what the 70 year old son said he'd sprayed on them decades ago to protect them. 
There's a High wall in .32-40 with close couple set triggers too, at a very low price. But the #3 barrel is 22" long, and set triggers wouldn't set. I'm betting it's a screw adjustment, but didn't try adjusting them when I looked it over. The Ballard triggers wouldn't set either, and backed out the screw a half turn, and they worked perfect. At $1200 the High Wall is a bargain, even with a possibly cut down barrel.
  

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marlinguy
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #6 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 9:51am
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Travelor wrote on Sep 15th, 2016 at 5:59am:
Very nice.

Bet your friend is kicking himself now.


I think he's close to that. He said he's anxious to see it all cleaned off, after seeing what the two spots looked like after just a little cleaning.
  

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marlinguy
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #7 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 5:39pm
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The Ballard Pacific took 5 hours of cleaning to get whatever was on the metal off! I'm not sure it was dried oil as the gun shop owner was told. I think it may have been spray varnish, as acetone cut it, but if I didn't follow quickly with a rag to wipe the wetted gunk off, it simply dried and remained on the metal! Of course I missed an issue when looking at it also! I tried the set triggers, but never cocked the hammer! And today I tried it and it wouldn't stay cocked! Just an almost cocked, and then it slipped off the sear and dropped. I ended up having to stone the cut in the full cock notch on the hammer to make it stay cocked reliably. But it's working perfectly now. Only took about 10 times of putting it together and having to pull it apart again, until it was finally perfect!
The varnish did do a wonderful job of retaining this Pacific as a time capsule! The rust bluing is 98%, and case colors a little faded, but just beautiful! Since it had never been apart, the buttstock was a real booger to break free of the metal, but fortunately no wood damage when I finally got it free! The varnish is 100% in most areas, with slightly wear of the varnish in the wrist.
I noticed some things I never even knew about the Pacific model, as I've never seen one this good, and this original. The thimbles for the wiping rod are case colored! I've always assumed they were blued, and restored Pacifics are always blued thimbles. But after seeing these, I'll now know they should be cased with the receiver parts! 

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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #8 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 6:01pm
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Vall, I'm thinking its time to start for you to throw a few bucks in for the lotto.    Great year for you so far and were only 9 months in Cheesy.   Beautiful gun!  Really kinda surprised to hear about the thimbles.  Great pickup! 

  
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marlinguy
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Ballards may be weaker,
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #9 - Sep 15th, 2016 at 7:06pm
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oodmoff wrote on Sep 15th, 2016 at 6:01pm:
Vall, I'm thinking its time to start for you to throw a few bucks in for the lotto.    Great year for you so far and were only 9 months in Cheesy.   Beautiful gun!  Really kinda surprised to hear about the thimbles.  Great pickup! 


Thanks Darin! It has been a very unusual year so far for me! I was very surprised about the thimbles, as I've always thought they were blued! Now I realize how many extremely nice Pacifics I saw and wondered if they were restored; actually were restored!
  

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Schuetzenmiester
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #10 - Sep 16th, 2016 at 1:30am
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Congrats Vall.  Great find and interesting about the thimbles. I know a guy I'm gonna quiz on that next time I see him  Roll Eyes
  

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57thahc
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #11 - Sep 16th, 2016 at 8:29am
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Angry Angry Grumpy ME, I knew I should have moved to the Beaver State ,a long time ago!! On the O.W.W.M. web,if you get an outstanding deal ,members send Cool or some times (you suck!!) AH YES,a silly response;but GEE WIZ,
I believe I need more SS. Maybe I should visit Dowagiac or Clare MI. to check on closet finds!! All in jest, Great find. Thanks for showing pics,I picked up a bent barrel,researched it,it is a Ballard has the rod thimbles and 
they are case colored, I was thinking fire damage,but barrel still has small remains of blue on barrel. I will probe Steve Durren for info. Again Angry ME but thahks for the pics. Dick Stack 57thahc
  

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marlinguy
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Ballards may be weaker,
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #12 - Sep 16th, 2016 at 10:09am
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Thanks! I am amazed by the originality of this Pacific. Internally the parts look like they were assembled within the last year! One interesting note was the extractor. Ballard extractors are marked for the caliber, and this one is marked. But not with the barrel marking of .40-85! It is marked ".40-63" on the extractor. Guessing a worker knew they used the same rim, so grabbed what worked. Not many made in .40-85 Everlasting, so probably didn't have one marked in that caliber.
  

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Chuckster
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #13 - Sep 16th, 2016 at 10:17am
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Very nice rifle, again. Interesting observation on the thimbles.
Always assumed the thimble barrel was silver soldered to the base.
In fact, have made them that way, but would not work if casehardened.
Must be riveted or some other technique. Don't think they are one piece.
Chuck
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Gunky Ballard
Reply #14 - Sep 16th, 2016 at 11:25am
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Chuckster wrote on Sep 16th, 2016 at 10:17am:
Very nice rifle, again. Interesting observation on the thimbles.
Always assumed the thimble barrel was silver soldered to the base.
In fact, have made them that way, but would not work if casehardened.
Must be riveted or some other technique. Don't think they are one piece.
Chuck

Thanks! You are correct Chuck! They are two piece, and riveted together. That part I knew from experience in trying to make some long ago. Guessing the thimble part got the rivet pinned in it, and then the base riveted to that. Now I wonder if the two pieces were riveted together after case coloring, or before?
Don't believe silver solder could be used before or after, as before it would melt, and after it could show on the fresh case colors.
  

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