Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 Send TopicPrint
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) bullets for oversized bores (Read 4908 times)
oughtsix
Global Moderator
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1362
Location: Columbus
Joined: May 31st, 2009
bullets for oversized bores
Aug 24th, 2016 at 9:01am
Print Post  
I am the lucky owner of two rifles with oversized bores.  Slugging the barrels revealed a  .325 bore on a Rem#3, and a .388 bore in a Ballard. (yes I checked multiple times with different micrometers)  My regular  sizes of bullets (.321 and .375 respectively) just slide down the barrel.   A bore light  in the breech  behind a seated bullet  showed a lot of light around the bullet.  I ordered new molds, .326 and .389, but wasn't smart enough to get tapered bullets.  out of 20:1 alloy the bullets need to be hammered into the bore, but they don't let light around the bullet! Way too much work.   

Since I plan on using them for offhand,  will fixed ammo  obdurate the bullet enough to fill the gaps to stop the gas from getting around the bullet?    Paper patching  the smaller bullets seal up the space, but Gee Whiz, on the .321 bullets that is a tedious process. 
The bores are not great but not really bad enough to reline and change an original.   Any suggestions as to how to make shoot without a barrel change? 

I haven't done a chamber cast- the cerrosafe is due to arrive today, but that is next. 

I know I should not buy these old things, but i am an addict.  I can't help it. 

Thanks
  

Life Member ASSRA, OGCA &  TSGC
I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters........ Frank Lloyd Wright
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
art_ruggiero
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1222
Location: CT
Joined: Dec 14th, 2008
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #1 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 9:20am
Print Post  
enlarge the base band on the321 mould and it should work    art
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 18072
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #2 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 9:53am
Print Post  
Enlarging the base band on a fixed case load might mean it will bulge the case, and wont chamber. It would work for a breech seated load though. 
What might work better is a stop ring design where the forward band is larger and will seal the bore, but it will sit above the case mouth, and thus not bulge the case to hinder chambering.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Water Bug
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 158
Location: north country NYS
Joined: Oct 11th, 2012
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #3 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 10:57am
Print Post  
A source for the alteration of the molds is Bill Loos  in Rochester NY. He is a very advanced collector and restorer of Schuetzen rifles, and he also does custom work on bullet molds. He has the fixtures and tooling.  He is one of the authors of the three volume Schuetzen books  also by Rowe.  If someone wants detailed contact info, send a PM.  WB
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ledball
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1021
Location: syracuse, ohio
Joined: Nov 20th, 2009
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #4 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 12:08pm
Print Post  
Let's talk about this next week at the match.  Ledball
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
svartkruttgris#369
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2980
Location: Colorado, Norway, Sweden
Joined: Oct 28th, 2014
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #5 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 2:38pm
Print Post  
For decades I have used one or more 0,060" fiber wads under 20-1 lead alloy bullets to very effectively seal against blowby of powder gases when available bullets are a few thous too small to seal by them selves. So far standard diameters of commercially available fiber wads have been large enough.

Typically is death of leading, unless really rough bore.

I have also used this with 100+ year old guns that I did not have proper size and weight bullets for -- such as 0,315" 40-1 Pb-Sn alloy bullets in 0,320 bores

I learned this practice decades ago for use with old rifles with eroded throats and first 10-20 cm of bores, where remainder of bore and crown were in VG to excellent condition. Stopped leading and reduced group sizes to typical for such rifles with excellent bores.

Have also had good results with undersized pure Pb bullets over full case BP loads, also using at least one 0,060" fiber wad.

Grisen
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JS47
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1265
Location: Arizona
Joined: Oct 12th, 2012
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #6 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 8:59pm
Print Post  
I had a similar problem with a .465 grove barrel.  I had Manson Reamers grind a neck/throating reamer that would allow me to chamber .466 bullets using 45/70 brass.  The reamer as I remember was around $70.  Adding the custom mold from Accurate it was a fairly expensive one-off operation. I ended up with a very rare Rolling Block chambered in .465 x 2.1. I seem to have a habit of spending money on strange projects.

JS
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Deadeye Bly
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1146
Location: Stephens City
Joined: Feb 25th, 2011
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #7 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 9:20pm
Print Post  
Shoot soft bullets-30/1 or so and black powder. The bullets will bump up to fit the grooves and shoot OK. I have an import Sharps 45/70 with .462 groove diameter. I have shot the 500 gr Gov't bullet at .458 diameter with very good results.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
John Boy
Ex Member


Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #8 - Aug 24th, 2016 at 9:59pm
Print Post  
Quote:
Any suggestions as to how to make shoot without a barrel change?
Yes, "Beagle" your existing molds ...
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
« Last Edit: Aug 24th, 2016 at 10:05pm by »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
oughtsix
Global Moderator
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1362
Location: Columbus
Joined: May 31st, 2009
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #9 - Aug 25th, 2016 at 8:27am
Print Post  
Off to the the range   with some Fg.  Will report tonight.
  

Life Member ASSRA, OGCA &  TSGC
I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters........ Frank Lloyd Wright
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
uscra112
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 4079
Location: Switzerland of Ohio
Joined: May 7th, 2007
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #10 - Aug 25th, 2016 at 8:50am
Print Post  
NOE just ran a group buy for us.  One option was a .325 base diameter tapered bullet.  My box is labeled 325-185-RF.  Should still be able to get one.   That doesn't solve the problem with your .38, but it should get you there for the .32
  

<div class=
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
oughtsix
Global Moderator
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1362
Location: Columbus
Joined: May 31st, 2009
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #11 - Aug 25th, 2016 at 3:53pm
Print Post  
USCRA,   I bought the .321 and the .323 from NOE, didn't think about the .325,  may be  a good option. 

Had some success today with  a Paul Jones  breech seated today. The most consistent cluster was with 4227 ( notice I didn't say group).   14 grains averaged  1440 ft/sec and gave a little leading,  I dropped down to around 1300 ft/sec and that  got rid of the leading.  All in all,  I think I could post a fair to middling offhand score with that rifle, with today's experiment. 

I tried some Fg for the first time ever.  35 grains gave almost a full case and I wasn't sure if i should pack it full to get 40gr in.  That gave me 912 ft/sec and the safest place to be was in front of the target. Bullets were all over the backer going in sideways.  And it was a mess and a lot of work, cleaning between each shot. 

In the .38-55,  I just used 14.7gr 4227 just to fire form the cases  to the rifle.  That gave me about 1000 ft/sec  and I'm not sure if I hit the  backer at all. 


My main goal was to get some fire formed cases for each rifle and that was a success.  I would have liked to spend more time with the .38 but the heat and humidity were oppressive and I had had enough.  I'll have 4  afternoons next week to tinker.   

If I  can get some fiber wads before I leave for the shoot next week, I'll give them a try.
  

Life Member ASSRA, OGCA &  TSGC
I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters........ Frank Lloyd Wright
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff_Schultz
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1661
Location: Ransomville, NY
Joined: Apr 25th, 2004
Re: bullets for oversized bores
Reply #12 - Aug 25th, 2016 at 6:39pm
Print Post  
  Congratulations!
Sounds like you had a very successful outing.
  

"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo

“There is no situation so bad that it cannot be made worse."

  Confidence- The feeling you get before you fully understand the situation.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send TopicPrint